travelr712's tags:
Well, that's not exactly true. I already knew her. She works in the cubicle next to mine. She's been there for about 4 months now. I know her, I've talked to her, I even lent her my copy of 'Monty Python and the Holy Grail' 25th anniversary addition, just so she could understand some of the quotes us guys throw around. She returned it, and I'm grateful.
 
What I mean is, I'd never really met her before today. You see, she's an 'independant woman'. Now before you start conjecturing, I don't really know what that means either, because in the past when I've known women like this, I always avoid them, Just like I've been avoiding her for 4 months. Well, not entirely, I did lend her the DVD.
 
You see, I've always been the type of man who needs to be needed. I've recently become aware of that trait. This means that the people who I have saught out in the past, such as the one in my living room, had particular personality traits that fed that need. People like her do not have those traits, and that always confused and intimidated me, so I just would not make friends with them. I would avoid them.
 
Let me give you an example. She told me today that she had been living for the past 6 months with her ex-spouse to see if they could put their relationship back together. Something we had in common, and a good point of conversation. And then later, she told me that she had flown to Fla for thanksgiving by herself, and enjoyed the time with her family down there, and when she got back yesterday, the spouse who had been so passionate about wanting to get back together, the one who had 'changed so much', told her that he felt something just wasn't there between them, and they should just get through the holidays and go their separate ways. I asked her why she had gotten back together with him, once again, for the 3rd time in 16 years, and she said because she loved him. Obviously, that was the truth. You don't keep trying with someone you don't love. But the difference with her was that when she came to work today, no one really noticed, and no one would have even known if I hadn't asked her. She just took an extra smoke break.
 
Let me tell you, I was having a hard time figuring out how to relate to her. All my old standby's were gone. She didn't mope around, and tell everyone how her dreams had been shattered, and look for sympathy, so I couldn't console her, and give her words of wisdom, and coax her through her down time. She just said 'I tried my best'. She didn't need me to tell her those things.
 
Then she told me that she only met her father twice, and never had spoken to him. He left before she was born, and just wasn't interested. And she said she really didn't care. She learned to deal with it long ago, and she figured that if he wanted to see her, he would make the effort. She already knew everything I could tell her about that. She had the same problems that everyone had growing up, some better, some worse, and she took it all in stride and figured it out for herself. Not much to work with there. She still didn't need me.
 
So I tried my old standby to relate, humor. I know a fast way to a woman's heart is to make her laugh, and I have a wide range of styles. Smart, silly, ironic, sarchastic, plain old jokes, puns, and she laughed at some and not at most. You see, she didn't just laugh at the ones that I thought were funny, just to make me feel good about myself, she laughed at the ones SHE thought were funny, and that REALLY made me feel good. She even made me laugh, and that's not easy to do. She DEFINATELY didn't need me there!
 
But I was determined to see if I have really changed the parts of me that I didn't like. It became a challenge to me to try and relate to this woman. What that caused me to do was to listen very carefully to her. To what she was saying. And I found out it didn't take long either. I could hear what she was thinking. But it wasn't because of my experience with women, it was because she told me what she was thinking. I didn't have to read her. I didn't have to guess. She just told me. Openly and honestly, because she didn't need to make me like her.
 
And I found out that I can listen, I mean really listen, to someone else. Not just hear what I think they should say, but really hear what they ARE saying. And she didn't even need me to do that.
 
And then I started to remember. She had all along come by my desk and stopped to talk for a minute. Not anything but just idle chit chat. I was always polite and cheerful, well, mostly, but I always kind of ignored it, I was busy dammit! The thing I realized was that she came to me. She didn't just always wait for me to come to her. She didn't need me to do that either.
 
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not looking for a girlfriend here. I've got enough trouble in that area right in my own livingroom. But here's a woman that has been trying for 4 months to do nothing but be herself, and be my friend, and she doesn't even need me to do that. It turns out I'm the one who is needy, because I need to be needed.
 
I understood something today. If I am ever with a woman like that, it's not because she needs to be with me, it's because she WANTS to be with me.
 
I'm gonna get to know her better.


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Comments

  • wombat said on Nov 27, 2007....
    Before I even saw the last few lines of your blog, I was thinking--now that's a lady with a head on her shoulders... sounds like you will be great friends.  And she has already given you a gift---understanding more about yourself. 
  • the_infernal_optimist said on Nov 27, 2007....
    That's really cool, trav. :)

    ~Infernal
  • Fallyn said on Nov 28, 2007....
    i traveler........that would be SOOOO cool. i hope you get to know her better!!!
  • destinydiva said on Nov 28, 2007....
    Glad you learn't more about yourself.... she sounds like a nice woman :-)

  • silverwhisper said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav, you should definitely get to know her better. perhaps lunch would be a good idea?

    ed
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    wombat - i agree! an important thing that i understand about myself now, or perhaps had come to understand before and am now putting into practice, is that i can be friends with all types of people. i think i always could have, i just didn't believe it myself. you know, i think she already knew we were friends, and i'm the one who didn't. go figure! :-)
     
    infernal - ain't it tho?
     
    fallyn - well, i certainly have the opportunity to, we both smoke :-) i intend to.
     
    des - i think she is, i'm not sure yet, i don't know her very well.
     
    silver - as always, i agree with you. i intend to get to know her better. as to lunch, umm, she and i are both in situations where i don't want to go that next step. but i had thought about it.... wonder what it would be like?
  • Fallyn said on Nov 28, 2007....
    smoke breaks you mean?
  • silverwhisper said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav: hm, no lunch then, huh? what about after hours?

    ed
  • destinydiva said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav I thought you packed in smoking.....
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....

    fallyn - that's right. it's been a good place to talk about stuff other than work it seems.

     

    silver - wouldn't that be taking it even more to the next step? i thought it went coffee, lunch, dinner, what not. :-)

     

    des - it turned out to be too much to for me to quit when the person i'm living with chain smokes.

  • Mr_Box said on Nov 28, 2007....

    I'm glad you met a cool person. But is it just me that doesn't ever believe anyone can really shrug off huge emotional events in their life?

    Her father skipped out and she's okay with that? Her marriage failed and she didn't even break a sweat?

    Some people cope by refusing to acknowledge their pain. And I've found that some of the strongest people on the outside are actually a big mess on the inside.

    Just something to think about. Forgive me for analyzing a stranger that I know nothing about.

    But I think it's good that you've identified your own personality traits and are now looking for someone different than in the past.

    Hopefully it will turn out better this time around. If not with this woman, but with future women.

    I live to be needed. And I'm not sure I would be happy in a relationship with someone who was so independent and well put together that I became unecessary.

     

  • silverwhisper said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav: me, i think maybe breakfast might be an option then, no?

    ed
  • evil_twin said on Nov 28, 2007....
    This woman sounds like she could be a good friend for you. Humor usually gets them every time :-P And I know what you mean about needing to be needed. It's funny because I like being needed too, yet I always seem to pick women who like to do everything themselves. Maybe because even though I want to be needed, I like being taken care of too. I think I'm a puzzle and I haven't quite figured myself out yet. At least you're on the right track!

    -evil_twin LA
  • PassionTraveler said on Nov 28, 2007....
    That was incredibly insightful of you. I think it was a real growth moment as well.

    Whether you connect with her or not, and whether or not you travel the friendship path or the romantic path, I think you now have new tools in your relationship-building arsenal.

    Congratulations.

    PT
  • Mamie said on Nov 28, 2007....
    mamie falls into a faint and lands in a heap by the computer.....:))
     
    you know what I mean....(no matter the outcome of THIS...) NOW THAT'S WHAT i'M TALKIN ABOUT!!:)) xo, Mamie
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    box - yeah, i understand what you're saying, and i thought about that too. maybe she's just an ice queen, i don't know. but to me, that's the point. i don't know. i've never ventured to find out with a person like that. i guess what i was getting at was that i had always been in these codependant relationships, and they never went well. i'm beginning to see that i don't have to do that anymore, and maybe a different type of relationship will work out better for me. who knows? but i'm gonna find out! ;-)
     
    silver - no. :-) you trying to tell me something dude?
     
    et - hey, i like the way you put that, you're a puzzle you haven't figured out yet. hmm, seems to me that's true of us all.
     
    pt - so you're not even a little jealous? :-P thank you, and i agree with you. i'm not looking for a connection, i've got enough going on right now as it is. but i can always use a new friend, and it will give me insight into people that i just never understood very well before, because they intimidated me, and so i avoided them. see what i get for trying new things? :-)
     
    mamie - LOLOLOL yeah, i thought you might like this one. i told you i would think about what you said. how do you like my solution?
  • Mamie said on Nov 28, 2007....
    STANDING OVATION
    HEARTY PAT ON THE BACK
    SMASHING CHEERS WITH A BEER MUG!!
    ....and this is like the first day or so...imagine when this really kicks in...oh no! You are going to have to carry a broom to beat the women offa you!!
     
    Have fun, make a ton of friends, fall crazy in love and keep writing these great stories!
    your friend,
    mamie
  • PassionTraveler said on Nov 28, 2007....
    Travelr, yeah, I'm a tad jealous. ;) But then I got kissed so well last night that my toes were curling, so maybe my dry spell is coming to an end as well. Hopes you aren't too jealous either. ;)

    PT
  • Twylarants said on Nov 28, 2007....
    Travelr- This sounds as though it might turn into a very comfortable relationship, whether it grows into nothing more than a friendship or becomes a romance.
    The fact that she learned to deal with her absent father and the breakup of her marriage says a lot for her ability to take care of herself.  It doesn't necessarily mean she's hurting inside, or cold and unfeeling.  It merely means she's capable of analyzing her situation and figuring out the best way to handle it.  Some people pay a therapist, some turn to a friend, some are able to cope on their own.   Aren't you glad she didn't bombard you with drama?   Sometimes people can need you even if they're not needy people.
    I'd better stop before I break into a Streisand song.
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    mamie - wow, i've had allot of problems in my life, but beating women off with a stick has NEVER been one of them! but i'm taking your advice here, because it's what i've already decided to do. have fun, make a ton of friends, and the rest, who knows? but thank you for the compliment on my story. you know, i got done writing it, and re-read it, and (trying not to sound arrogant) i thought, wow, that was pretty good! :-)
     
    pt - well, not TOO jealous :-) i don't exactly know if my dry spell is coming to an end or not, i'm not really looking at it that way. but i really hope for you yours is! :-)
  • silverwhisper said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav: i was referring to meeting her for breakfast at a local place, to be honest. :p

    ed
  • Alyss said on Nov 28, 2007....
    I hope this is the beginning of a new friendship for you. ;-)
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    ed - uh, yeah, sure, right! i believe you. no, really! i do! honest! thpthpthp :-P
     
    alyss - thank you. i hope it is too. but if not her, there will be others. maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon, and for the rest of my life :-)
  • CreativeWoman said on Nov 28, 2007....
    trav,
    You've written a lovely thoughtful account of this woman.  I hope you continue to learn more great thing about yourself.  :-)

    CW
  • lfbno7 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    It sounds really bad to me. I really don't think you should allow yourself to get emotionally involved with her. She's in love with someone else. It's a no-win for you. Your only shot is to let her do all the moves, be cool towards her, and see if she ever falls out of love with the other guy. Or, alternatively, you can crash your head with a rock 40 or 50 times, same result.
  • destinydiva said on Nov 28, 2007....
    lmao mr7 :-) 
  • lfbno7 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    Did you really laugh your whole ass off? Or were you exaggerating?
  • destinydiva said on Nov 28, 2007....
    whole ass!!! :-)
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    cw - thank you. my writing style has changed a bit since i was last here, no?
     
    lfb - other friends at work have been pointing at the door and telling me i should go slam my dick in it. same effect, i should think!
     
    but really, everyone, i know many of you would like to see me in a wonderful relationship with a wonderful woman, and that includes me :-) but this post was not really about her. it was about how i have changed my perspective in the way i view women and relationships, friendship or whatever that may be. i am REALLY not thinking about doing anything other than learning more about this woman as a person, because i've never had friends like this before. that's what i'm after, not romance, or breakfast. but i'm flattered that so many people care enough to wish that happyness on me. thank you all.
  • Fallyn said on Nov 28, 2007....
    that makes actually a LOT of sense. you're so smart trav.
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    fallyn - thanks, but i'd rather be pretty :-)
  • wombat said on Nov 28, 2007....
    travelr712:  Thanks for the response.  Yea--sometimes people just "Click.!"  Amazing when that happens!
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    wombat - oh, i agree, i agree!
  • tbs230 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    I learned something today too about people!! it's not as great as what you learned...in fact it's kind of depressing, but ANYWAY! I'm glad you met someone who wants to be your friend and is making a concerted effort because she wants to!

    Definitely sounds like a keeper.
  • tbs230 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    I learned something today too about people!! it's not as great as what you learned...in fact it's kind of depressing, but ANYWAY! I'm glad you met someone who wants to be your friend and is making a concerted effort because she wants to!

    Definitely sounds like a keeper.
  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    tbs - so what did you learn?
  • gingersoul said on Nov 28, 2007....

    Trave......i like her. She acts like me. My last ex boss wrote about me in her reference letter that i never let anynone see my personal problems even though i was in the middle of my nasty divorce. I took it as a great compliment.

    Your lady here knows how to separate personal life and professional one. I do the same so i know she is not hiding anything because she is a psycho.....:-)

    She is acting professionally in a professional enviroment. I bet that when you will know her better she will open her heart to you if she thinks you are worth of it. I say...invite her for a coffee....approach her gently....she is hurt and damaged...but she knows how to take care of herself....

    uhmm....am i talking about myself now?....:-)

  • travelr712 said on Nov 28, 2007....
    ginger - i don't know, are you? and i agree, she does know how not to place her personal problems on the people around her, at least at work. i don't know what she's like outside the office. i am interested to find out tho.
     
    we had 2 women on our team for about 4 months. they were REAL man haters. it was my job to train them, and i simply gave up after 6 weeks, because they just COULD NOT get past the fact that they believed i ended every sentence with 'you idiot'. i understand how people get damaged, but their actions and reactions were so overt that the boss told my admin that he better either fire them or he would fire the whole team. now that's bad office behavior! oh, and every customer i've run into has told me how terrible they were at their jobs, and how bad their attitudes were. you don't get  comments like that as a gift, you gotta earn it! :-)
  • tbs230 said on Nov 29, 2007....
    I learned that no everyone wants to know you...no matter how much you want them to. They won't put in the effort or the time and that's something you can't make them do.

    that's what I learned.
  • travelr712 said on Nov 29, 2007....
    you're right about that, tbs
  • crybabylu said on Dec 04, 2007....
    Okay, it's been 6 days since you did this post.  So,  how do you feel about it today?

Comment on "I met a woman today... :-)"

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He looked at me and said, "There's a man in your past who has done you a lot of harm."...
"Man ... cannot learn to forget, but hangs on the past: however far or fast he runs, that chain runs with him." (Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche)...

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