Actorguy's tags:

I have been sitting here staring at the comment window for a very long time…wondering what to write…wondering if I should write anything.  But I have learned since being here that writing helps, so here I go.  If you are in a good mood and don’t want to spoil it, this would be a good time to stop reading.

 

A very good friend of mine took her own life this past week-end.  I found out last night, and honestly, I don’t know what to think or feel.  Sadness, of course.  She was a bright light in my life and I will miss her…a lot.  She always had a smile or laugh to share, or a new puzzle to bring me. Like me, she was a puzzle fiend. 

 

Anger is pretty strong too.  Someone once said that suicide is the ultimate “Fuck You!” and that’s kinda what this feels like.  I don’t understand it. I would have bent over backward to help her and she knew that…at least I hope she did.

 

I guess what I feel most of all is guilt.  I have read enough about suicide to know that when someone who has been depressed for a very long time suddenly tells you that they’re feeling better, it can be a very bad sign.  It can mean that they’ve reached a decision.  I guess that’s what it meant when she told me that a week ago.  I feel like I should have been paying more attention…that I should have heard warning bells going off…that I should have seen this coming.  But I didn’t.  This completely blind-sided me and I’m still reeling.

 

Anyway, I was right, this has helped.  I don’t expect any comments….I certainly wouldn’t know what to say to a post like this.  Just knowing you’re out there helps a lot.  And if you’re the praying type, then say a prayer for my friend Nina….and for me.  I know that helps too.



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Comments

  • MissMimi said on Oct 01, 2007....

    Actorguy, I am so sorry for the loss of your friend.  Such a shame.  Suicide not only takes the victim-- it leaves loved ones wracked with grief and guilt.  I hope in time the guilt you feel will lessen.  It goes without saying that you did nothing wrong.  Your friend was ill, and it caused her to make a terrible choice. 

    It's just so sad.  I wish I had something wiser to say.   {{{hugs}}} 

  • evil_twin said on Oct 01, 2007....
    I'm so sorry about your friend. That's horrible. But I really want you to know that there was nothing you could have done. When someone really wants to kill themselves, they're going to do it. And very seldom do they ever reach out to anyone that could change their minds. They make the decision and they stick with it. They've past the cry for help stage. It's so heartbreaking and I also understand your anger too. Suicide is such a selfish act.

    I wish there was something I could say to make you feel better but I know there isn't. I'm just sorry that this happened. I feel for you and everyone else who loved your friend.

    -evil_twin LA
  • Battycat said on Oct 01, 2007....
    I'm really sorry this happened, but like E_T said, there's nothing you could have said or done.
    There's nothing more I can say {{{hug}}}
  • Actorguy said on Oct 01, 2007....
    MissMimi, e_t and Battycat:  Thank you for your thoughts.  You are right e_t, this was no cry for help.  She checked herself into a hotel - presumably so no-one would find her - and was found by the cleaning staff in the morning.  I didn't pick up on the signs, but it seems she didn't want me to.  Thank you, MissMimi for reminding me that depression is a disease.  I need to remember that your thinking can become so twisted that irrational acts seem to make sense.
  • beyondtheveil said on Oct 01, 2007....
    actor- There is so much that can be said about depression and hopelessness, but when someone does this, the people left behind are usually going through what you mentioned- anger, guilt, and of course a sense of loss.

    I've known a couple people who did this and family and friends were as shocked as you, and went through the same emotions and wondering of what more they could have done.

    No one understands unless they have felt the same hopelessness this girl did.

    I wish you and her family well and hope you realize soon there was really nothing you could have done.
  • gingersoul said on Oct 01, 2007....

    Actor.....i am truly sorry for your pain and your loss. There are many ways for a suicide. She chose the most spectacular one.

    There are other people who suicide themself slowly, day after day....at the end the death they end up being caught in is again their choice ...

    Suicide is the extreme act because it doesn't give closure to the ones who are left behind. They will have to live with the doubts and the question and no anwers. They will have to found out their own answers in order to accept the event, digest it and move on.

    Don't blame yourself too much. I know its easier to say than to do.

    I know it because I am still dealing with the guilt caused by my sister's death...

    It never goes away.....you recall one look, one word, one day, one goodbye and you cant forgive yourself for not having said something else, of for not having stopped and remained with them a little longer or  for not  having called ....or written or talked.....

    Its a vicious circle.

    Hope you can find a way to reach a closure with her.

    Your poor friend was suffering too much and i believe at one certain point nobody can help them anymore once they have crossed the line. {{{hug}}}

  • botoni said on Oct 01, 2007....

    ACTORGUY....I am so incredibly sad that this has happened. The shock and the grief rank up there with the greatest that anyone can feel. This has happened to me twice and it still pains me when I think of the circumstances. The first was a young woman who had for many years walked in a visible cloud of depression. The day before she killed herself I saw her. She talked and laughed with me and was the happiest I had seen her in years. The next day we knew why.
    The second time it happened I found out when the coroners office phoned to tell me about the suicide note he had left addressed to me. Comforting his family and other friends was one of the toughest times of my life. I feel for you and I pray that you will find peace in time. Dont buy into guilt. When someone has made their decision there is no turning back.
  • rmuxagirl said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Hey actor guy...my prayers are with you.

    Its times like these that makes it hard to understand life or what goes through someone's head.  You had no idea what she was thinking and were probably happy to hear she felt better.  You had no way of knowing that's what she was thinking other than her coming right out and saying it to you.

    And mimi is right depression is a disease that really no one can help someone else with.  If you need someone to talk to my door is always open...
  • Me-Myself&I said on Oct 01, 2007....

    i have been sitting here staring at the comment box wondering what to say........

    i'm sorry for the pain you are feeling. I will say a prayer.

    take care  see ya

     

  • silverwhisper said on Oct 01, 2007....
    i'm sorry about nina, actorguy. don't blame yourself for not seeing it: hindsight is 20/20, and you know that, i think.

    work through your anger, try to control your guilt.

    i will keep you and her in my thoughts.

    [moment of silence]

    ed
  • lfbno7 said on Oct 01, 2007....
    "I guess what I feel most of all is guilt.  I have read enough about suicide to know that when someone who has been depressed for a very long time suddenly tells you that they’re feeling better, it can be a very bad sign.  It can mean that they’ve reached a decision.  I guess that’s what it meant when she told me that a week ago.  I feel like I should have been paying more attention…that I should have heard warning bells going off…that I should have seen this coming.  But I didn’t."

    What you are feeling most of all is guilt.  You think you should have been able to prevent her suicide, that it is your fault.  Let's say you are condemning someone else for failing to prevent a suicide.  That person "should have known it was coming" because Nina said she was feeling better.

    Yes, I agree with you, you are a terrible person, and so is this other fictional person who also should have known, because Nina said she was feeling better.  You both should feel terribly guilty for failing to know that when Nina said she was feeling better, you were supposed to immediately call God knows who or try to counsel her yourself.

    I'm putting it awkwardly, but I'm trying to express that it would be unreasonable to hold someone else responsible, and therefore it's unreasonable to hold you responsible, and you are completely free of real guilt, and by condemning yourself to guilt you are also condemning any other blameless person too.  You're not the only one who failed to prevent a suicide.  If you condemn yourself you are also condemning all the others.

    You are guilty of not being psychic.

    There is one person in this story who is guilty.  Her name is Nina.  She messed up.  Or she was in so much torment that she didn't mess up, she escaped.  I'm inclined to think the former.  I believe that we do have a purpose in life, and since we can't see the machinery behind it all, we need to stay here at our posts until that limousine comes to transport us back home after a job well done.  I think Nina gets an "incomplete" in this particular course.
  • secretlife said on Oct 01, 2007....
    praying for you and nina....for peace and understanding.
  • simplyklo said on Oct 01, 2007....
    I'm sorry for your loss - it's not your fault though.  Even knowing the warning signs, if someone is serious about taking their own life, can you really stop it?  I doubt it.
     
    My dad has been seriously depressed for a long time ... I have even taken phone calls from him where he was in tears (not the image I am used to from my big, tough dad) ... it scares me though and I fear he too could make a decision like that one day.  Not sure I can ever stop him if he decides to though ... I hope so and I'm sure I'd feel the same guilt you do if I wasn't able to ...
  • quietone said on Oct 01, 2007....
    actorguy ~ I am so sorry for your loss, and of course will say a prayer for you and Nina.  You did all one could do..don't accept the guilt. Like ed said, hindsight is 20/20.  {{{hugs}}}
  • skald said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actorguy.  I am very sorry to hear this. Please accept my deepest condolences.

    ((((((((((Hugs))))))))))) 
  • nytquill17 said on Oct 01, 2007....
    I am so sorry for the loss you're going through.  I don't have anything to say that hasn't already been said.  No one can truly understand what you're feeling because your experiences and your feelings about your friend are unique to you, but please know that all the thoughts and feelings you've described are completely normal and natural.  Take the time that you need to get through it.  Talk it out, if it helps.

    When I was in high school, in theater, one of our better actors committed suicide not long after starting college.  He was a great guy, involved in so many things, always laughing and making others laugh - we never saw it coming.  There were any number of us that would have tried to help if we had only known something was wrong.  We were a close-knit group and it hit us hard.  We pulled together and hung on to each other, shared our grief and anger and confusion.  I hope you have someone in your "real-world" life that you can lean on for that kind of support - and I see you have already found a lot of support on SoulCast.

    You'll be in my thoughts.  I'm sorry :(
  • Holly-Go-Lightly said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actorguy~
    so sorry for the loss of your friend, Nina. I'll keep
    you both in my prayers.
     
    Regarding clinical depression (I am an unfortunate
    expert on the subject), you don't say if she was on
    meds or not, or if she had gone off them recently?
    But I wanted to say~when someone gets down to
    that point, they normally aren't thinking of loved ones
    or what happens after they go.  They are so lost,
    and it's all about pain. When you said you would have
    bent overbackwards for her etc. I just wanted you to
    know~it wasn't because she shunned your help so to
    speak, or anything like that. when someone is that
    depressed~when they come to the decision they KNOW
    that no one can help them, they are living in so much pain.
    Every day, every moment, torturous, horrible. They decide
    the only way to stop the pain is to end the life.
     
    Also, I think guilt comes built-in to a suicide, as  many have
    mentioned here. I'll be praying for your comfort and finally,a
    way to find some sort of peace with this tragedy.
     
    God Bless~*~Holly~*~
  • Artemis223 said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actor -
     
    Just wanted you to know I am thinking of you and will certainly keep you & your friend in my prayers today. 
     
    - A.
  • MissMimi said on Oct 01, 2007....

    I agree with Holly.  I have gone through two bouts of suicidal depression.  At the time, the mental pain is just so excruciating, that death seems to be the only way out.  It's the most terrible pain I've ever experienced.

    I'm just so sorry Actorguy.  I'll keep you in my thoughts.

  • wombat said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Please add my thoughts and prayers. I wish I knew any kind of words that would help, but I know that there is nothing anyone can really do when someone is determined to choose this road.  I can only wish for you to come to terms with it and find some peace and understanding along the way as you grieve for your friend.
     
    {hugs from wombat}
  • kruuyai said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actorguy:  I'm sorry for the loss you're feeling, and I've been through that, too.  When it happened, my boyfriend at the time made the comment that suicide is a selfish act, and that people who do it are inconsiderate.  It was a pretty insensitive comment to make to someone who was grieving the loss of her friend, and it also shows how we all have a tendency to interpret the events in the world around us from our own perspective.. in other words, how it affects us.  I agree very strongly with what Holly-Go-Lightly said.  Nina's suicide wasn't about you.  She wasn't shunning your help.  Her pain was just so intense, and she wanted to stop it.... and she did that in the only way she knew how.  I hope that she's found peace and will be stronger to face her special challenges in the next life.  I hope also, that you will be able to find peace with yourself.  I know how easy it is to blame ourselves when someone we love dies.  But ultimately, you know that you aren't responsible for her death, just as you weren't responsible for her depression.  Know that you filled a special place in her life, and you never know.  Maybe your friendship with her actually prolonged her life longer than it would have gone on had she not known you.  It works both ways.  
  • Holly-Go-Lightly said on Oct 01, 2007....

    MissM!

    nice to see you again. didn't know you & I had this

    particular situation in common. I hope you have found

    some way to cope, and also, I'm glad you're still here.

    you are a blessing to many people on SC, myself

    included.

  • CreativeWoman said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actorguy,
    I am so very sorry about the loss of your friend.  I will pray for you both. I agree with the others who have said not to blame yourself. 

    Hang in there,

    CW
  • soleme said on Oct 01, 2007....

    I'm terribly sorry over the loss of your friend.

    Although you and her family and friends are at a loss, I pray that she is at peace.  

    Take care

  • *daisy* said on Oct 01, 2007....
    My thoughts are with you, I hope you can find peace within urself soon. x
  • Alyss said on Oct 01, 2007....
    I'm so very sorry about your loss. Try not to beat yourself up, you are not responsible for another person's choices or actions.
  • Mamie said on Oct 01, 2007....
    oh boy. I am so sorry Actor.
    The only thing I can do is pray for you...and for Nina and all the people who are suffering now. I wish you this bear hug ((((((hug)))))) and I hope you feel the peace of Christ within your heart and soul...He will comfort you as only He can.
  • pickersplock said on Oct 01, 2007....

  • MsStar39 said on Oct 01, 2007....
    So sorry to hear this, keeping you in my prayers.
  • wakingharmony said on Oct 01, 2007....

    Actor~ It's all been said over and over, How sorry we all are...The loss of Nina may be felt deepest by you, but know that we are deeply affected by your sadness. One thing I would be willing to bet my own life, is that she really could not see the sadness that is felt by all those that love her....now that the tears and sorrow wash your hearts I am sure, she knows that deep love now as she was blind to before, for whatever reason And I am sure she wishes only happiness and lessons of love from this passing.. Bless You & All her Loved ones & friends.

    Always & Forever Margaret aka wakingharmony 

  • sweet_cookie01 said on Oct 01, 2007....

    actorguy i am sorry you had to go through this emotional chaos...

    losing a friend to suicide would make anyone feel that way... we cant help but say "What could have I done to change what has just happened?"

    its so sad that she gave up on life... and i am sorrier that you had to feel that way.

    there is nothing i could say that would relieve you of the burden you are feeling right now... but i promise you and nina will be in my thoughts and prayers.

  • confuzzledwife said on Oct 01, 2007....

    Actor Guy

    ugh- what a depressing post :(

    I knew someone who committed suicide- a very good male friend of mine 18 years ago.  I never even knew he was suicidal, he was always happy- I later found out by his note it was an act- he was miserable.  I wondered for years how I could have missed that!  I was consumed with guilt, I talked to him the night before he hung himself- he was joking and laughing (as usual), nothing led me on to think he was depressed in any way. No one knew he was suicidal. 

    Later on though, I couldn't help but remember the wonderful family he left behind- his loving parents, sister and baby brother who was only 3 at the time- imagine having to explain this to a 3 year old?!  No one suffered more than his parents.

    I have had my fair share of problems, we ALL have.. suicide is a very selfish act-

    there's NO way you could have known and there's nothing you could have said and done.  You are in my prayers because I know how hard it can be.

    Take Care.

  • Jenna said on Oct 01, 2007....

    I am the praying type...and I am praying for you and nina!

    God bless dear one!

  • Actorguy said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Wow.  I am completely overwhelmed by the response to this post.  As you may know, I sleep during the day and woke up to find this.  I'm speechless.  When I wrote this, I hadn't been to bed since hearing and most of my night was spent in deepening guilt and confusion.  Nina and I worked together, she was a popular driver, and everybody last night was feeling pretty shell-shocked.
     
    Sleep has helped me gain some much-needed perspective and your words of kindness and support have helped even more.  What an amazing group of people you are. During the summer, I convinced Nina to drop by here. She commented on one of my posts and read many others but never stayed around. I wish she had.
     
    I usually make a big effort to respond to everyone who comments, but today I just don't have the energy.  Maybe tomorrow I'll come back and try again.  Please don't feel slighted if I don't mention you.  I have read all of your comments 4 or 5 times and they have helped me immensely.
     
    To the new and fairly new faces simplyklo, soleme, *daisy* and confuzzledwife, I apologise for the depressing post.  I'm usually a pretty happy guy!  You caught me at a bad time....sorry.
     
    Holly:  I'm so glad to see you back!  I have thought of you many times...wondering how you survived the fires and hoping your beautiful city has recovered. Your words and insight made a great deal of sense to me. Thank you.
     
    lfbno7: As usual, your backwards logic helped me look at things from a different angle and it helped. Thanks.
     
    Kruu:  You are such a wise woman!  Already, a lot of my anger and guilt is being replaced by sadness.  Nina was only 37.  What a waste of a wonderful woman.
     
    Again, thank you all.  You have been a big boost for me.
  • the_infernal_optimist said on Oct 01, 2007....
    ((hugs))

    I'm so sorry that you're facing this loss - and I don't know what to say, because I don't think anybody has magic words. I'm here too, though.

    I'm not surprised at all by the anger/guilt part of what you've been feeling. My mother has made several suicide attempts, some of which required hospitalization, and anger and guilt were always hot on the heels of the shock I felt.  It's not fair that they would want to take themselves away from you - or hurt themselves when so many people care...but people who hit that rock bottom don't think like we do. They can't rationalize, and the demons they're wrestling have blocked all of the sources of light in their lives - and sometimes, no matter what you do, you just can't claw through to them. It's not your fault; it's not even really her fault.

    And sometimes, even if you DO see it coming, there is literally nothing you can do. If that person shuts out all avenues of help, your hands are tied. It sucks, but what I'm saying is that even if you had seen it, as horrible as it sounds to say, you might not have been able to break through to her, so it's not reasonable to blame yourself for not seeing what was happening.

    I will say prayers for you and for her soul tonight.

    ~Infernal
  • minniemouse said on Oct 01, 2007....
    Actorguy....All I have to offer are hugs and support if you need it.....Minnie
  • blastfromthepast said on Oct 02, 2007....

    Actorguy:  I'm so sorry to hear the terrible news.  My deepest condolences.

    Love, Blast

  • UnknownUser said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Actor, I'm so sorry to hear about your loss.  Sending heartfelt sympathies to you.  This particular type of loss is so hard to deal.  Don't feel guilty as there really is nothing you could have done.  Take care.
  • queenparanoia said on Oct 02, 2007....
    actorguy: i'm so sorry to hear this. anyway people commented here has laready commented what i want to say. my prayers are with your friend nina...
  • scipio said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Actorguy,
    My Heartfelt condolences to you and everyone concerned with this tragedy.
  • RollingC said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Actorguy.... I'm so sorry about what happened.  My father committed suicide after a long bout with depression and it was totally unexpected when he did it.  I feel for you as this experience can leave you reeling with pain and confusion all the way down to your bones...down to the depths of your soul.
    It's easy to say " why didn't I see the warning signs ? " but that's after the fact and when someone that's so cheerful and even a family Icon (in my case) does that you realize that it takes an outsider or professional to spot those signs.
    I'm so sorry to hear that and I'll keep you and Nina in my prayers.
    Rc
  • Actorguy said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Thank you so much everyone.  Your thoughts and prayers and hugs have been greatly appreciated and badly needed.  Since posting this, I have come to understand clinical depression a lot better and a lot of my anger and guilt have been replaced by at least some degree of understanding.  I still love her and miss her, and I will for a long time, but I hope she has finally found peace.
     
    It will have to wait till the weekend, but I will drink a toast to Nina. It was great knowin' ya kiddo.  I know your journey was a tough one, but you left behind a lot of love and laughter.  Go with God.
  • Holly-Go-Lightly said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Actorguy~
    Bless your heart~I'm so glad you were able to take something from
    my comment, and use it to help you understand.
    I think it's pretty raw to participate in the "suicide is a selfish act"
    club. That is not condusive to your positive thinking.
    How can it be a selfish act~when the person committing it isn't
    thinking with a clear mind?
    In fact, even the catholic church changed it's stance on suicide,
    saying the suicidal person can't be punished for an act they choose
    without full mental capability. So, now it's off the mortal sin list (LOL)
    because even they finally recognized it for a medical/emotional illness.
    Anyway, just wanted you to know that. Nina is positively blameless.
    In fact, she is probably sailing above you now, on the wind, through
    the clouds, warmed by the sunshine, cooled by the breezes, and
    finally, finally completely free, peaceful, and happy.
    I will raise my glass as well~To Nina~bless you
    and to Actorguy~keep taking those baby steps~you have alot of
    support here!
    ~*~Holly~*~
  • Actorguy said on Oct 02, 2007....
    Thanks Holly.  You have helped a lot.  It's great having you back.
  • pookiedookie said on Oct 30, 2007....
    Sometimes, I am just a wisecracker, or try to be, but i do nosomething about this subject.  I had someone close to me kill herself, and believe me, it didn't have anything to do with any of us who new her.  She was bright, witty, well-educated, most of the time, funny, but she had really high highs, and real low lows, and when she got off of balance, she just couldn't think right.  Real sorry you lost her, she sounded special, really special.  I know it's hard not to think about it, but try to put it out of your mind.  But before doing that, think of all the things you liked about her, and how special she made youfeel.  And if it helps, talk to her, and tell her how you feel, and thank her for being a part of your life.  I did this, and it helped me a great deal.   Happy thoughts!
  • Actorguy said on Oct 31, 2007....
    pookiedookie: funny you should say that, because I do talk to her, and it does help.  Its been almost a month and most of my anger and guilt has faded.  I know that the pain was just too great, even if she rarely showed it, and I hope she has finally found peace.  Nice to meet you and thanks for your comments.
  • Holly-Go-Lightly said on Oct 31, 2007....

    *Actorguy* funny I should stumble upon this, as I have been
    wondering if one month's distance from the situation finds you in
    better spirits?? I hope you have been doing well.
    ((((HUGS))))
    ~*~*~Holly~*~*~

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