Master_Williams_whisp's tags:
This is in response to MissMimi's question on a previous blog.
 
MissMimi... although you will often see D/s and Bdsm (and pain) seemingly included as a unit, many D/s relationships have no pain element. To the person who is truly submissive, the worst kind of punishment is the witholding of attention by the Dominant.
 
Pain is sometimes used as punishment, particularly with a submissive who does not enjoy pain, but it is not the primary way of changing behaviour within the relationship.
 
There does seem to be a high correlation between subs and the enjoyment of pain, and Dominants who enjoy inflicting pain. BDSM play often involves pain. Not always though. BDSM play tends to push the mental limits of the sub. This can be done in many ways... restraint of the physical kind (ropes, chains and leather)... and restraint of the mental kind, as in "Don't make a sound", "Don't move", "Ask permission to (have a drink, go to the bathroom, have a drink, eat something".
 
Generally, pain is used to the degree that the sub enjoys it... unless the Dominant is pushing for growth in that area, or is using it as punishment.
 
I hope this helps MissMimi... please keep asking and I'll keep answering. This post sparked a very interesting conversation with Master....
 
He is waiting for me right now, so the "sub-space" post will follow.


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Comments

  • silverwhisper said on May 06, 2007....
    whisp, thank you. :>

    ed
  • secretlife said on May 06, 2007....
    you hit the nail on the head saying the worst kind of punishment is withholding of attention.  the other big one for me is the notion of disappointing your Dom. 
     
    i don't enjoy pain mimi, and my first relationship there was no pain involved save for a little spanking (with the hand, no floggers). 
  • botoni said on May 06, 2007....
    Great explaination Masterww
  • sweetsoul said on May 06, 2007....

    Adding my agreement to withholding attention and disappointing your Dom.

    One of the things I appreciate about D/s relationships is that each one is different, a result of the needs/wants and negotiations of the D/s. While there may be similarities between relationships there is also room for individuality. You just need to find a D/s that agrees with your desires for a relationship.

    I'm not into pain for pain's sake but I've been more than pleasantly surprised to discover how an element of pain can make the pleasure more enjoyable. Also you can tolerate more pain when you are sexually aroused/excited...endorphins would be my guess.

    I think it also makes a huge difference when the pain is administered with pleasure and not punishment in mind.

  • MissMimi said on May 07, 2007....
    MWw, thank you so much for taking the time to write this. I can certainly see where mental punishment could be just as, or more, unpleasant as physical pain. Some of the BDSM erotica that I've read is so extreme that at times, it frightens or angers me because I can't understand how one person could allow another to use them in such seemingly cruel ways. I don't know where the fulfillment is in that.


    So I end up thinking maybe I do not have submissive tendencies after all because I know I couldn't deal with some of the things I've read. Then I end up more confused than ever. I only know there is a part of me that longs for this in my life, and I want to learn more. I hope you'll forgive me if some of my questions end up sounding foolish.
  • AnnonymousNympho said on May 07, 2007....

    Whisp - this is a great post! And it's so true. I personally like pain but I have a couple of friends that are involved in BDSM who do not. Everyone has different kinks and different limits.

    Mimi - You can absolutely be submissive and not into pain. There is a difference between wanting to serve and craving pain. For some people submissiveness and masochism go hand in hand, that's the way it is for me. But there is a distinct difference between the two. Other people who are submissive but not masochist will sometimes find pleasure in submitting to pain because it pleases their Dominant. Remember...books are fiction, often what you read would not really be possible in real life.

  • lioneljay said on May 07, 2007....
    I was surprised to learn how satisfying it can be to give pain. That said, I don't think that I'm a sadist. Rather, giving pain has been part of my discovery process as I learn my way in D/s. I find it curiously pleasurable to control another person's experience to the extent that I can inflict pain. And it's simply because it's what I want to do at that moment and because she submits to whatever I choose for her (within the boundaries of our checklist agreement, of course).

    As SS said above, pain can be eroticized under the right conditions. Further, pain can enhance sexual pleasure if it's administered at the right time. Sharp pain given just as she falls into climax can turn a single orgasm into a wave of them that seems to never end.

    However, when one inflicts pain as an intentional part of a scene, it's absolutely crucial that you also attend to the site of the pain during aftercare. Applying lotion to a reddened bottom, for example, or icing swollen parts can be a tender and soothing part of helping the sub during aftercare.

    SS and SL both mentioned that there is also the pain of disappointing one's dom or of being ignored. In my view, this is the reality of such relationships. A sub gets much of the satisfaction in the arrangement from pleasing the dom so when there is disappointment it can be excruciatingly painful for the sub. I understand that, and choose to show my disappointment in a severe way only in the most severe circumstances.
  • Master_Williams_whisp said on May 07, 2007....

    Wow MissMimi, please don't ever hesitate to ask any question. All you need to do is look at the sharing that this post brought out... an answer to one of your questions, and you have to know that questions are a really good thing... smiles. Thank you for asking!

  • Master_Williams_whisp said on May 07, 2007....

    Thank you all for sharing your points of view. I really enjoyed reading them, and I'm very honored with the time and care you all took to reply. This is exactly the kind of discussion I've been looking for so *kisses* wherever you might wish them... to all of you.

     

  • Daniel68 said on May 07, 2007....
    I don't enjoy giving or receiving pain. I don't understand BDSM I guess. 
  • lioneljay said on May 07, 2007....
    Daniel, our sexual interests put us along a very long continuum. That the place on the continuum where you are happy does not coincide with where those reside who enjoy D/s, says only that we're different. As long as you are spiritually fulfilled in your sexual practices, what else could you possibly ask for?
  • MissMimi said on May 07, 2007....
    Also, Daniel, I am very skittish about pain. I admit, some pain as sexual arousal builds intrigues me very much. But pain for pain's sake? Nope, I'm not into that. Mental domination is what really intrigues me.
  • lioneljay said on May 07, 2007....
    MissMimi, for dinner tonight you may eat three peas and one scoop of mashed potatoes. Is that clear? [/hijack]
  • MissMimi said on May 07, 2007....
    Yes, sir. May I mix them? /another hijack
  • lioneljay said on May 07, 2007....
    Only if you wish to become very well acquainted with a certain black suede flogger. [/hijack]
  • gingersoul said on May 07, 2007....

    LJ...so Jenny Craig is ultimately a Sado?.....LOL.....

    I think in any relationship the absence of attention is the worst punishment ever. And the fear of disappointing our lovers walks side by side with the fear to be disappointed by them and by ourself.

  • tbs230 said on May 07, 2007....
    ohh, this is very interesting. I once tried that with someone I met on Lit. Now, mind you, we never met, and it was all through aim and email, but for those few weeks, I learned alot. I don't think I'm into taking alot of forceful direction, but I do like to be told what to do during intimate moments. I always crossed it off as being inexperienced. It does get the juices flowing though, if I may be cheeky.

    I've always just been scared of confessing this to whomever I was with because I don't want to give full control over to someone, but I love the direction...does that make sense?

    Hmmm, maybe I should make this anonymous...whatever, I'm probably going to blog about this anyway. Thank you MasterWw for writing this. I've been intrigued by BDSM for a little over a year now, and it's always wonderful to find a forum where it can be openly discussed.


  • Master_Williams_whisp said on May 08, 2007....

    tbs... welcome aboard. It was kind of a secret hope that some might enjoy following my journey of discovery, under the care and control of my Master and Mistress.

    mmmmm... that feeling of allowing yourself to fall under the control of another is enjoyable for a lot of people, just as taking control is for others... and it's ok to just want it in the bedroom. Many who aren't into day to day power exchange are into "bottoming" or "topping" which to me has come to mean that the exchange of control limits itself to the sexual side of a relationship.

    If we can help with any questions... you're safe here.. and I'm glad you decided to let us know who you are.

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The quick version.......
Recently...
The first session saw me back over His knee for the first time in too long and soundly spanked before being re introduced to His belt...
regret...
i did it again...