silverwhisper's tags:

The page you were looking for no longer exists

ed’s note: once again, it is my pleasure to welcome to my soulcast soapbox the ever-insightful secretlife as she muses on the final of the seven deadly sins, pride.

Pride/Arrogance (Latin, superbia)
Pride is almost always listed as the first and most serious of those seven deadly sins – the ‘sin of sins’, if you will -- because the thought is, if you didn’t have pride, you’d not have the arrogance to commit the other six.
Thomas Aquinas summed it up this way:
Inordinate self-love is the cause of every sin…the root of pride is found to consist in man not being, in some way, subject to God and His rule”

Dante’s definition was:
love of self perverted to hatred and contempt for one’s neighbour

In Dante’s version of hell, the punishment for pride was being broken on the wheel.

In Milton’s Paradise Lost, it’s pride that gets Lucifer and his band of angels thrown out of Heaven and into Hell—they think they’re just as good as God, and shouldn’t be subject to His laws. It was the sin of pride which transformed Lucifer from an angel into Satan himself.

Yet we live in a society where pride is considered a virtue, not a sin.

We’re supposed to take pride in our accomplishments-
We’re supposed to take pride in our children-
We’re supposed to take pride in our country, our heritage, our neighborhoods, our homes, our appearance…

It’s all very confusing, isn’t it?

We just got through talking about the sin of envy—and I thought we said that you had to love yourself first in order to love others?

I specifically said envy was the result of low self worth.

And that we need to build our self esteem to do better and envy less-

Yet pride is one of the seven deadlies – and not just one, but the worst one!

And isn’t pride all about having high self esteem?

In order to have pride, you must have a sense of your own value—and that makes pride fundamental in the achievement of self esteem.

So is self esteem a good thing? Or the route of all evil?

Damn it’s an endless loop!—A vicious circle…

OK—stop and think.

You only need to have a child to realize that from their earliest days, we as parents consider it our solemn duty to instill a sense of self-worth in our children. We want them to believe they can make a difference; we want them to be able to confront, not retreat, from life’s challenges—to be able to bounce back when faced with difficult situations. We want them to learn from their successes as well as their failures, and to treat themselves and others with respect. We understand that ultimately, we are teaching our children to assume responsibility, to act independently, to be able to deal with frustrations…

Without pride, we have no means to obtain self esteem and without self esteem, we’re doomed.

Circles…
The ancient Greeks called excessive pride hubris. In their literature, it was usually the trait that led to a tragic hero’s downfall. This type of pride was seen when the protagonist attempted to go outside or beyond human knowledge, action, or capacity—
It is in this negative connotation that pride is usually referred to with respect to religion.
Speaking of religion, did you know that Pride is mentioned forty-six times in the King James Bible, but it’s never referred to in a positive way? The reason is simple. God doesn’t see pride as a virtue.
The Christian belief is that pride destroys. In fact, the Bible says:
Pride goeth before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall.(Proverbs 13:10)

In Christian ethics, humility is the virtue which counters pride. Pride is the attitude of self-sufficiency toward God. Humility admits that we are unworthy, inadequate, weak.



********************OK Stop the bus for a minute!*************************

First, we teach our children that they should value themselves—we puff them up.

Then we teach them that humility is a virtue?

It makes no sense
.
Pride and Humility can’t both be considered virtues because they are in direct opposition.

We send out mixed messages.

I was right—it’s a vicious circle!

******************************Start the bus again******************************



Let me try it this way…

The expressions of the deadly sin of pride as Dante spoke of it, are: arrogance, vanity/narcissism, and dominance/aggression.

These are the expressions of pride run amuck.

If you are arrogant:

  • You are unjustifiably confident in your ability
  • You believe yourself superior to others
  • You look down on others
  • You fail to give credit due
  • You belittle others to make yourself look better


If you are vain/narcissistic:

  • You are unjustifiably confident in your attractiveness to others (i.e., conceited)
  • You are overly concerned with yourself in a shallow or superficial way
  • You are selfish – it’s all about You You You…
  • You are egotistical
  • You are elitist

If you are dominant/aggressive

  • You are controlling
  • You are manipulative
  • You believe yourself superior
  • You are selfish – your desires are most important
  • You are not opposed to using violence, or threats of violence to get your way

So is it all just a matter of balance? Sometimes pride is good/sometimes pride is bad?

Maybe.

There is certainly a thin line between righteousness and self-righteousness. But there’s actually more.

Pride is deceptive. It lies. Pride skews our perception of reality. We say, “I don’t have a problem with pride. I’m just being myself.” It’s hard to see the truth when it’s your own heart that’s lying to you.

So instead of saying I’m wrong; I think I am right. I stagnate; I don’t learn, I don’t move in a positive way forward.

Instead of saying I’m sorry; I don’t ask for forgiveness. Even though, most times, others are willing to absolve me. Rather than move on, I carry guilt.

Instead of listening to those around me, I insist I am right. I shut ideas off instead of opening my heart to new and better ones.

Instead of admitting that I’m getting old, I cover up the signs of age. I make beauty about the physical instead of about the truer deeper meaning. And in doing so, I cheapen it.

I think I must always be strong – weakness is not allowed. I don’t ask for help when I need it. I isolate myself—I cause our own loneliness.

And on and on – selfish, hurtful, blind…..we think we are invincible**

WHY?
WHY?
WHY?

My opinion is this: We’re full of pride, because we’re afraid to admit our own mortality…..we’re afraid to see that we’re all going to die.

We don’t want to be reminded of the ephemeral nature of youth and beauty…We don’t want to be reminded of the brevity of human life…And we most certainly don’t want to be reminded of the inevitability of death.

Because of our fear, we lose sight of the thing that’s most important in life. We lose sight of love.

Love is patient, Love is kind, does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.--1 Cor. 13: 4-7


**thanks scaly for that thought
***thanks again ed for this guest spot on your space.


del.icio.us Digg reddit StumbleUpon

Comments

  • mobil said on Oct 09, 2006....
    You should be proud of yourself SL ! You really nailed this pride
    thing.

    "Pride comes before a fall", It's an old saying and one I've seen
    come to be many times. More than a few times after my own
    forays into self indulgence.

    YES SL, Love does conquer all, without God there would be no
    love, no light in the tunnel at all. Love trumps all sin, pride included.

    Love is what makes life worthwhile, there are so many kinds of
    love and feeling it in any of it's ways takes sickness, sin and
    even death to the back burner of life.

    It's fantastic to talk and ponder these things. Such talent here,
    and love. Thanks SL for another splendid romp, this time to
    pride and thank you SW for allowing the lovely and talented
    secretlife to fly in your airspace.
  • scalywag said on Oct 09, 2006....
    secret....I don't have the time to read this now but will later. I'm glad you got it done. :)
  • rmuxagirl said on Oct 09, 2006....
    another good one SL.

    I think pride isn't so much as taking value in your work/self. Pride to me is more always telling people you did something in hopes of making them feel inferior. Like humility is like saying "oh it's nothing"

    Pride in my eyes is more of thinking you're the best you can do anything and no one else can. Everything you do you do for yourself and nothing for others...
  • happykat said on Oct 09, 2006....
    It's a really long piece, but (with all due respect) why is this on ed's blog?
    I don't get it. Why not on Sl's blog?


    Anyway, Rise and Fall of Rome and all that...
    :}
  • secretlife said on Oct 09, 2006....
    mobil: thank you for being the first to read! i have been thinking and thinking about pride for weeks now. when ed began the series on the 7 deadly sins, i just wanted to do pride! i'm glad you enjoyed it and could follow my circles round and round...

    that's not so easy to do!

    scaly: you know how hard i've been working on it! i'm glad to have gotten it done. you've got to come back and tell me what you think.

    rmuxgirl: i'm pretty sure you nailed it- the core of all of these sins seems to be selfishness.

    happykat: i know it's LONG! you have no idea how many times i cut it...

    ed started a series on the sins a week or so ago. when he did, i commented on his blog that he had beaten me to it because i'd been thinking of writing something on them myself.

    he then generously asked me if i wanted to take one or two to write about. i wanted pride....he wanted to give it away!
    lol....so anyway, that's how i got here.

    i thought since this was his series, it would be fun to have it run like a guest appearance thing. I liked that idea alot-
    i'm back to my own 'space' now...
  • RollingC said on Oct 09, 2006....
    Great post...and I like the idea of " Guest Speaker ".
    Very well handled and the fact is pointed out that society needs to re-evaluate itself.
  • lioneljay said on Oct 09, 2006....
    Well done.

    I've often heard that it's "overweening pride" that is the real sin. It's also fair to say that we have co-opted the original definition in modern usage so that when we say pride today we mean a more neutral, less exaggerated scale of pride than Dante did.

    In a lot of ways, it just goes back to something that Dizzy Dean said many, many baseball seasons ago, "It ain't bragging if you can do it." It isn't pride if it's true in the eyes of god.
  • lucky7 said on Oct 09, 2006....
    wow your couldnt have nailed it better!!!
  • secretlife said on Oct 09, 2006....
    2 thoughts:

    LJ i was reading Ann Rand's "Atlas Shrugged" this past summer, and her philosophy of Objectivism. In Rand's philosophy, "Pride is the recognition of the fact that you are your own highest value" - Since this book was written in 1957, and this philosophy was quite popular, i'm not sure if it is somehow responsible for the shift in pride as a 'sin' vs pride as a virtue?

    All: Being raised Catholic, i recall the story of Jesus - right before his death, washing the feet of his disciples.

    His act of stooping down to wash their feet was a parable of his whole human existence - this one act was considered to be beneath even the lowliest slave. Yet Jesus lowered himself willingly...Nobody took his life from him - he freely laid it down for us. Others didn't humble him- he humbled himself.

    If you think about it, he HAD to do it this way. His purpose here was to undo the original sin of Adam and Eve- They disobeyed because they wanted to know what God knew....they wanted to be like God. The serpent's venom was this deadly sin of Pride......the antidote for this perfect humility.

    I always remembered this story......it's a beautiful one. And if nothing else, gives us something to think about-
  • missb said on Oct 09, 2006....
    Great one, SL :)

    Pride can be confusing to understand. We have to take pride of our own self worth but also fully understand that we're all God's children, that we're all equal in God's eyes.

    We’re supposed to take pride in our accomplishments-
    We’re supposed to take pride in our children-
    We’re supposed to take pride in our country, our heritage, our neighborhoods, our homes, our appearance


    All are true and we are entitled to that kind of pride. But when we think;

    No one but me can accomplish that,
    My children are the best, the rest are dumb and ugly
    My country is the most superior, etc

    Then pride has crossed the line. I think we have to take pride and humble ourselves at the same time. We take pride but also acknowledging that we can't do it alone (God, family, friends)

    The Jesus story was an excellent example, SL. I like that story too.

    Anyway, like everyone said, you nailed it, SL!!!

    Cheers :)
  • FaithfulDisciple said on Oct 09, 2006....
    SL: I think it would be best if you came up with a similar episodic series of topic discussions in your own post. The manner you discussed these topics seemed like a textbook I had way back in my theology course in college.

    Pride is the capital sin, the greatest of all follies. It is delusional because it fails to admit one's limitations over others. No one man is perfect. Man is meant to complement one another.

    When one begins to understand that we all need one another to survive, then we realize that we need to interact. Foolish pride is refusal to admit one's imperfections and refusal to take responsibility for one's mistakes. Thus, one can't seem to evolve from from where he/she is currently is in to where they should be going. Pride is in effect self limiting and destructive.
  • secretlife said on Oct 09, 2006....
    thanks missb!

    FD: i've never had a theology class in my life! Some philosophy courses a long long time ago, but that's about it....

    Thanks for adding in the part about us all needing each other!!!
  • scalywag said on Oct 09, 2006....
    Secret....I know you spent a lot of time on this piece and it shows. It has a very clear progression and is easy to follow.

    I think it's as long as it needed to be to get your point across. I know you cut a lot out....it must have been long before.

    I find this interesting.....two of the things I'm most proud about are my kids and my work. Being proud of my work is what drives me to do it well. I'm not sure what the result would be if I wasn't proud of it.

    And my kids.....well that's just the way it is.

    But I think your final conclusion is correct, that we lose sight of love.

    What would humanity be like if we all had less pride and more love? Would there be more tolerance and peace? I think so. Maybe in our part of the bigger picture.....our little piece of humanity....we could make a difference.
  • sam_ting_wong said on Oct 10, 2006....
    silver, I am proud of you.

    You should also take pride in this superb post.
  • satyr said on Oct 10, 2006....
    I am humbled reading this....and the comments. I shied away from making comments for a while, feeling unworthy. If I had the ability to respond in the manner I would like, I would have made comments similar to scaly's. Silver and secretlife - awesome job. It is love we lose sight of, and that is truly the deadliest of sins.
  • silverwhisper said on Oct 10, 2006....
    i have to say, SL, i'm quite happy w/ the way this guest blogger thing has worked out. good job!

    ed
  • boyzmom said on Oct 10, 2006....
    "We want them to believe they can make a difference" is only half of what we should be doing. This may cause pride so we have to make our children believe that with help they can make a difference, and always to Thank God for what they accomplish.

    My grandma used to say "the Lord helps those who helps themselves". I finally figured out that I was thinking I needed to do things myself and was not looking for God's help or guidance. That is pride. I put the Lord first now and it works much better.

    Instead of taking pride in our work we should work like we are working for God. Who wouldn't want to do a good job for a loving God.

    I think there are ways to instill humility into everything we do to get rid of that foolish pride. Even in our country we can be proud and humble because God gives us a place to worship him no matter where we are. We can always pray for our politicians to make choices that are inspired by God himself and be thankful when they do.

    We should have self-esteem just by knowing that God loved us enough to send his son Jesus to die for us. It is not a bad thing and it is different than pride when we interject a little humility into the equation.

    We all need to strive to be like Jesus but we all will fall short, that is where our humility will come from. We just have to find ways to use that here on earth.

Comment on "on the nature of pride"


(Separate tags using commas, for example: New York, dating, vegetarian)