• queenparanoia said on Sep 12, 2009....

  ewwwww. they had sex on your bed???? i hope you burn the bed after you divorce him...

   

  {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  He kept the bed, Queenie - with my blessings!
   
  I bought myself a beutiful sleigh bed when I left - LOVE it!

• Mr.Strange said on Sep 12, 2009....

  I can feel the pain in your writing.
  
  I am not much for thinking we should be forced to be intimates with only one person for life.  No culture before us has happily achieved this medium, it seems like an unreasonable option.
  
  On that same note, hiding things, and only sharing the events after the fact is a massively dirt ball thing to do. 
  
  The way I look at relationships is you do not own one another.  The commitment should never follow the trend of ownership.  Work together, be honest, communicate, never deny, or hide your desires.
  
  I desire variety, my gf of three years does as well.  We have yet to move up to the step but we are both open about it, and both openly discussing the terms of how it would work so that we are both comfortable.
  
  Do not forget, humans have sex more for pleasure than reproduction, well your philandering husband was out and about.  You could have equally sought out your own on the side lover.
  
  I know it is ok for men, but not ok for women, I say screw the norm.  Sex can be about love, it can be about passion, it can be about fun, it can be about pleasure.  Really good sex can be about all of the above.
  
  I say rather then hold onto the wrongs done to you, which they were.  It was not so much the sex that is the issue rather; the betrayal, as he disrespected you openly and unapologetically, that really hurts.  To add insult to injury he confesses his love, well really not respecting your position.  You can not truly love someone, or yourself for that matter if you do not hold respect at the top.
  
  I hope this helps, and I wish the best for you.
  

• gingersoul said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Oh yeah...drunk dialing, uh?
  
  One suggestion: do no pick up the phone next time....you have ID caller on, right?
  
  You and only you are the owner of your time and you life...don't let him in anymore.
  
  He did enough and you are through. No respect, no love, no understanding of your feelings and the tears you shed because of him, no tenderness toward your commune past, no accepting of his own mistakes......nothing but a cheap, drunken blabbering at the phone...
  
  He is like a dirty river trying to wash you away with him..
  You have built you life savers...you are immune now.
  
  So..next time...for yourself.....don't pick up the phone, Wish.
  
  

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Mr. Strange - you have expressed yourself so well, especially with regards to something most would consider a controversial and sensitive subject.
   
  You really targetted my feelings quite accurately when you defined it as betrayal - it was the lies, not the actual sex, that devastated me.  If it was solely about the sex, the marriage probably could have been salvaged.  As you might expect, he was not very responsible in other areas either. 
   
  It may not be that romantic, but as a scientist, I have both a biological and a far more idealized view of sex.  I am in no position to judge anyone else on a mutual understanding like the one you have with your gf - in fact, I admire your open communication.
   
  By the same token, I am very much a one-man kind of woman.  No moral undertones here - I just don't think I could handle more than one relationship at a time, and I also don't think I could detach my emotions from the physical aspect and take a lover on the side.  It's not as much fun, but I can get off by myself, for what it's worth - and crudely, from a scientific standpoint, I do think we humans need that occaisonal release.
   
  Thank you so much for giving word and form to my jumbled thoughts and emotions.  Yes, clearly it was the lies.
   
  Ginger -  It would be easy for me to try to excuse myself by saying that I sometimes fear for his safety, and I am afraid not to answer in case it is a real emergency, but that is only partly true. 
   
  I do need to know that he is doing ok, but the darker truth is that I am almost vindicated that he is suffering without me.  God, that is really hard to admit - I pray that I will honestly be past that someday - it's been slow progress letting go of this whole mess. 
   
   

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  "I am not much for thinking we should be forced to be intimates with only one person for life."
   
  I left this out before - I wholeheartedly agree, Mr. Strange.  He was actually the one who insisted on getting married!!  Double standard - wanted me at home, and freedom to do what he wished. 

• gingersoul said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Wish......betrayal is all we feel when we had reached out and we have been hurt...deep down is our inner core that has been ripped in two..
  
  Trust is a word that becomes very difficult to pronounce again, if ever, after that...i know it very well..
  
  But once you reach the point of no return...you can't allow this person to hurt you again...
  
  The process is damned slow and painful....but not picking up the phone is a little but necessary step toward your own healing..
  
  He has to be said this, he has to listen......and he will be past through it...each of us does.... eventually... in different shades and grades....or adjusting that pain to our new lives in a way it doesn't burn anymore.....
  
   
  
  
   

• Hegemone said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Good for you Wishy, SO good for you!  You sound so strong and I want you to hold on to this!  It's like you are really finding your stride, how wonderful.  That is truly sad if he 'did his best', because it doesn't seem that it was much, and that's a sad thing for him to really be that ... incapable.  While I'm sorry you had to be faced with such memories last night, I'm glad you're able to move through these things easier each time.  (((((((((HUGS)))))))))))

• Mr.Strange said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Wish not to stir you on...being a person of science I'm sure you could appreciate this statement.
  
  How can you be informed that you are incapable of having a relationship with more then one man at one time, with out experimenting?  You expressed you did not "think" you could do it.  More often than not, we find out amazing things about ourselves when we dive in, and try a new experiences.
  
  I am not suggesting you go out and get into a few orgies, though if you do; please bring your video camera!!!!  I am saying that in my experience and those of people that I have talked too, we as humans are capable of loving, and lusting, for more then one person at one time.  Why would this idea not work in practice, as long as everyone involved is well informed, emotional intimacy is not withheld and group participation is an option.
  
  I recall reading about cultures that regularly offered there wives to traveling sailors as the most precious gift they could offer.  Under the idea that they are such beautiful joyful parts of there lives, that both parties wish to share.
  
  Something else is a thing called dogging which I came across on craigslist as a husband was offering up his willing wife for the experience with a time and place.  Dogging is big enough to have its own wiki page.
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogging_(sexual_slang)
  
  The only judge you have to get by here is yourself, sexual freedom is completely empowering.
  

• Mr.Strange said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Wish missed your second reply...
  
  I have heard about that before, where the man insists on ownership, and closed relationships.
  
  Usually it is not the intent, they just want control of the sex, and of there partner, its an act of jealousy.  Jealousy often leads to breakdowns in relationships, martial or otherwise.
  

• woman said on Sep 12, 2009....

  It's amazing how old feelings can be stirred up or rise to the surface. Old feelings often without old reality. They are difficult to take Wishy and I think you are doing well. And you are right. You are doing just fine by yourself. Keep it up. woman

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Hege - I AM kinda hitting my stride.  It makes it easier not to be so angry anymore.  In so many ways, what happened back then made what's happening now possible.  I am doing stuff I would have never even imagined.  Breaking me down allowed me to build myself back up again, on my terms.  It's been hard, but amazing - and still a long distance to go.
   
  Mr. Strange - You made me laugh so hard!  Valid point, about experimentation, but I'm an old lady now, and I know myself pretty well.  It's more of an emotional hesitation than a moral one.  I could very easily get hurt, and I'm just not that brave at the moment, although sometimes, I can be a spitfire!
   
   

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Woman - I hate when SC cuts the rest of your response!!!
   
  What I had said was that it's kind of weird for me to relive such sadness when I am honestly very satisfied with the direction my life has taken since the divorce.  I think a lot of it had to do with 9-11.  He was drawn to me by his grief, and I was vulnerable.  Thankfully, there is enough geographic and emotional distance not to repeat the same mistakes.

• Mr.Strange said on Sep 12, 2009....

  Wish I know you are not suppose to ask, but like I follow rules :-P
  
  How old are you?
  
  I am 28, I often forget how old I am, I remember one time when someone asked me how old I was at the time I was 25 and I answered 23.  Age is how old you feel, time is relative.
  
  You are only guaranteed to be alive here, and now.  Beyond that you could be dead, before that you can not change.  You seem like a woman of integrity, I am sure if you get over your doubts and just start living, others will find you irresistible.
  
  Simply irresistible :-D
  
  I wanted to embed the video...but youtube has it disabled.  A link is the best I can do.
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3geoXOdnJQ
  

• wishyouwerehere said on Sep 12, 2009....

  I'll be 41 in about a week - and I like my age, so no biggie ...

   

  BTW - I love that song - very clever lyrics.  And yeah, sometimes, I can be a powerful force, but I'm pretty sure most are able to resist ;)

• Mr.Strange said on Sep 12, 2009....

  well sounds like your an introvert, as I am.  I tend to do things alone, collect my ideas, create, write, what ever.  Gather up that force and energy, then go out and disperse it amongst people.
  
  It feels like spreading seeds in a field, very liberating.
  

• the.food.critic said on Sep 13, 2009....

  Infidelity, the bane of love, always was the harbringer of ill luck. I'll admit I pity the guy for making such a mistake when he still seems to love you like he does. But my heart goes out to you for suffering it, and its just right that you be strong enought to do what your are doing. Good luck.

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