Recently, I've had two difficult periods of posting in Soulcast. One involved realmenluvporn, and another a post by labyrinth. Two very different people in very different situations, and as a Christian I don't try to play favorites between who treats me well and who doesn't.
Realmenluvporn arrived on the scene at Soulcast and caused a religious stir by openly calling out Christians. He stated they were worthy of contempt, and even hatred. I didn't feel personally attacked by this, but I felt the need to engage him because it's all too easy to judge Christians.
I attempted to learn about him, ask him questions about his faith background, and other things. His username description used to say something like "I was in the Southern Baptist Church for awhile...but I got away, despite their best efforts." I asked him about his experience in the Southern Baptist Church and the next day, his username description changed. After a few postings he asked me questions that I answered fully, and I had questions of my own. They went unanswered. He made it clear he didn't give a shit about my beliefs, didn't want my prayers, and called me a used car salesman.
Throughout all of this, I didn't call him names, didn't write him off, and certainly pushed myself to connect with him. It became clear that he didn't care to continue any more dialogue, and for all intents and purposes, he closed himself off from getting to know me. If he didn't, he might have seen a different Christian than the ones he so willingly hates. But his hate is enough to include me, though I have done nothing to him.
Yesterday, I went to one of his posts, "would the real antichrist(ians) please stand up?" and read the replies. Then, to my surprise, I found that although I hadn't posted a reply to that post in half a month, I had been blocked from replying. All for trying to tell him that Christianity isn't merely what he hates...there is more to it.
Recently, labyrinth posted something very important, asking soulcast users if he should tell his wife that he had an affair with her over 10 years ago. It seemed like a genuine question, so I weighed in on it: be honest and tell her. It seemed so obvious to me. But most of the replies encouraged him to keep the secret, mostly so that he wouldn't ruin a good thing going. Besides, he's been a great husband ever since.
I believe that to be a serious lapse in morality, for reasons I explained in the post. A fellow Christian, FaithfulDisciple, disagreed with me on my position, while I felt he was saying something God never did, or assuming how God was working in the situation.
In order to clarify, I quoted Bible verses, made comparisons, and explained the effects of lying and deceiving others, especially loved ones. It was soon seen as vindictive and judgmental.
And this is the reason for this post. By telling the truth, others have been made VERY uncomfortable. It has incited hatred, disappointment, guilt, and a myriad of other feelings that I am not aware of yet. I don't post this to "start something" with any of the above named people, or to vent against them without actually speaking to them, but here is the point:
The truth is often not comfortable.
Whether realmenluporn elects to block me or disrespect me, especially if I go against his blind hatred belief that "all Christians suck", or if I don't go along with the majority of those soothing labyrinth for keeping his mistake hidden from his wife, there are consequences that have made me a bit unpopular.
And I do not concern myself with popularity.
If anyone can forget their own anti-religious or anti-Christian bias, and is honest with themselves and not sugarcoating or hiding their mistakes, the Bible says a great deal about how life works. It cuts to us deep and forces us to be honest with ourselves - that we mess up enough to be punished severely. But Jesus Christ saved us and belief in Him will give us Heaven forever. That is the gift of grace - Jesus died in our place so we wouldn't have to suffer - He gave us something we didn't deserve.
So what do we do with that grace? Go ahead and live our lives, telling ourselves and each other that we're ok without a god, because we can do it on our own? We can earn forgiveness from God or from ourselves? My friends, this is foolishness. You can earn money, and you can earn respect, but you cannot earn forgiveness. If you have to "guilt yourself" and punish yourself until someone forgives you, then that's not really forgiveness. If you sin against someone else and they aren't aware, you can ask God for forgiveness, or try to forgive yourself, but how can you truly be at peace when the other person involved has no idea?
Further, we resent God and what He has said or done in the past, whether we believe it or not. It sounds too harsh, too awful, too unfair. There's a reason for that. God is perfect, and we are not. So His rules and His law are things we cannot keep. We've failed before we even begin. That's all we seem to see. But then Jesus makes things right, and we think he's a cool hippie guy who was majorly hated on - aww, poor Jesus. Then we live our lives without Jesus, trying to get forgiveness from ourselves, living in guilt and shame because we feel we can't share it with the people involved - you KNOW this happens, Soulcasters...many of us have shared things with anonymous people that no one in our REAL relationships know...a random guy from Kentucky can know more about your marriage than your own spouse...and that is a damned shame.
I will continue to speak the truth in order to show people that where they go wrong, they can make the right choice and admit wrongs to each other...you can't ask forgiveness if you don't confess to doing something wrong, in the first place. But Jesus gives the forgiveness we all need to make life something meaningful. I may come across strongly in saying it, but if it's the truth, and more people pass on it than accept it, doesn't that justify my devotion to sharing the message all the more? I do this out of love, so that no more of the dozens of Soulcasters I read will live miserable lives trying to fix things themselves - and believe me, there are many out there. You might be one of them. There is something better than keeping secrets, or writing off those who say uncomfortable but true things. That is unconditional love, and that is something Jesus IS, and something I have and will continue to share, even if loving someone means telling them where they've gone wrong, so they won't have to live with it.
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lidstrom82 posted on Sep 04, 2006
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Comments
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madstorm said on Sep 04, 2006....
If love is unconditional there CANNOT be rules and laws because by definition the word 'unconditional' MEANS no conditions i.e no rules and laws...
God is Love... Love is Compassion.... Compassion is pure forgiveness...
There is only Love... for that we don't need Jesus...
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bitterlove said on Sep 04, 2006....
to madstorm: ... are you deducing it based on your own understanding? Because it's like saying something that's nearly it yet not it. It's like saying:-
I took a dip in the pool. Taking a dip in the pool means I took a bath. Taking a bath means I'm clean.
while in real fact, you're only wet. And not clean.
to lidstrom: I really appreciate what you said because it rang clearer than bell. We humans try to hide things and cover it up with all sorts of logics, but in the end, only we ourselves know what really is beneath.
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Jenna said on Sep 04, 2006....
I admire your writing. As I have read your comments to others....while you have a very strong opinion, I have always felt you expressed it in a respectful manner. And reading your post today has me thinking and perhaps reconsidering my thoughts on the labyrinth matter.
Keep writing....I, for one, will continue reading.
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ALIENated said on Sep 04, 2006....
I must admit that I have ignored answering comments from
RMLP on my posts. I later delete them. I liken it to washing
graffiti off public walls. I think no one is beyond help, but
some are beyond my help. Anything I say would only fuel
their fire. Some people are so far on the dark side only a
personal encounter with God Himself will bring them back.
I have developed my beliefs over years of hearing and
reading the Word. I could not hope to explain it all to
someone here. Especially someone hell bent not to listen
and not to give any credence to the Bible, which I believe
is inspired and given to us by God. There is no scientific
way to prove the existence of God. We believe in God by
faith. If we say "the Bible says so" and they say "the
Bible is crap", then the discussion is over.
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Jenna said on Sep 04, 2006....
Alienated... can you not listen to anothers point of view even if it differs froms yours? Can you not just reach out to them...not judge? I am a believer...God and I have a very special relationship...I listen to others and simply state my thoughts... can you do that without cutting someome out of your life? Just something to think about...
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maggie02mae said on Sep 04, 2006....
You, my fellow Christian, are a comfort to me.
Write on. Love on.
The world needs you.
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lidstrom82 said on Sep 04, 2006....
Unconditional love means simply this: to love and accept a person without a payback, like "I love you because you love me", or "I love you because you serve my needs." Too many go along with this, loving only those who love them. I've tried to continue loving others even though they misunderstand, even resent, me. I do this because that is unconditional love.
Unconditional love also means telling the truth to someone even when it's not easy for them to hear. If emotional hurts are like physical wounds, then many of us stay injured rather than face the truth and seek healing. If you have a sprained ankle, and I encourage you to keep walking rather than admit the pain, you never heal. That's not loving for me to do.
By the same token, if someone is racked with guilt or emotional pain, and I tell them to stop and face it, it's uncomfortable for them - and conclude I am being unloving, or judgmental. Quite the opposite. I point out the obvious pain so that you can heal, and NEVER crawl or limp again.
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Mamie said on Sep 04, 2006....
Hi Lid, I am not sure why you are worried aobut people's reactions to your posts. Someone asked for your opinion and you gave it, others weighed in. Your truth may not be their truth, but isn't that between them and God and not you and them? Don't make it a "thing", bless the conversation, know you have shared your truth and continue on!
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lidstrom82 said on Sep 04, 2006....
Because, Mamie, it's not the people's reactions I'm concerned about, it's their well-being.
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ALIENated said on Sep 04, 2006....
Jenna: I can listen to people's point of view if they are
sincere, but I do not have to receive it and let it stand
on my posts. RMLP admittedly was giving us the business.
I did listen to his point of view anyway. I am just not
going to argue with him. It would be pointless because
he is trying to make some point of his own. I shook the
dust from my sandals and moved on. I think Jesus is the
way and he does not. End of story.
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Mamie said on Sep 04, 2006....
hi, just me again, I hear ya, I am just not sure that their well being is your job...I mean, your testimony is one thing but even Jesus who threw over the tables at the temple did not then beat the people about the head. Just my opinion! Who asked me? NOBODY!! Have a good night!!
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hotaka said on Sep 06, 2006....
bitterlove - That was great. You're not clean; you're only wet. Funny and to the point!
lidstrom82 - Another excellent post. It's too bad that someone like you, who believes he is doing his best to help others, is so under appreciated at times. But that's life as a good guy. Some people just want to live with their ideas of the world and will not accept anyone trying to open their eyes. HBC once said to you something like he couldn't accept your beliefs for himself but he could respect where you were coming from. Some people just don't want to respect you because of your beliefs.
As for labyrinth's post, I could hardly say anything. The "right" thing may be to tell the truth and ask for forgiveness but I see some very terrible times ahead if that's the case. If the marriage dissolves and the children can only see their father on weekends and maybe think their dad is a loser then is it worth it? It's a tough situation and one I am glad I am not in.
Perhaps we would all be better off not getting ourselves into trouble in the first place, or at least consider the outcomes of our decisions better. But who among us is that good? Not I.
I'll part with some song lyrics that I have been leaving as of late. They're from a Deep Purple song.
How many words we waste to justify a crime,
Compared to an act of love that really takes no time.
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RollingC said on Sep 06, 2006....
I wrote a reply to q/rmlp that he didn't like (I guess) and I made matters worse by putting a ps.-Real men Love Jesus- at the end. I figured that if you can dish it out you can take it also but I guess I was wrong as he blocked me right after that. No matter...lost my ID and had to re-register under this name but that showed me his true colors. Not wasting my time reading his rantings anymore.
I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one that was "blocked" by q/rmlp.
Lidstrom82-excellent post and although I am a firm believer in God-and telling the truth- I don't think that after all those years of 'good' behaviour by Labyrinth he should risk putting his relationship at risk
God Bless and keep writing....
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lidstrom82 said on Sep 06, 2006....
I think part of the debate about labyrinth is that there's a perception that telling his wife would make things worse. I contend that adultery has ALREADY made it worse, but he's not fessing up to it. In that case, telling her won't make things worse - he's already done that by cheating. Years of good behavior has also included built-in guilt over the issue, as well as dishonesty.
Hotaka, I understand that telling the truth has some awful consequences. We can't assume what his wife will say, whether divorce is certain or not. He'll only know if he tells her. If marriage is the ultimate relationship of love and respect, keeping adultery a secret is undermining and shortchanging that relationship. I can just imagine his wife praising him for being such a faithful, caring husband, and every time in the back of his mind labyrinth must think, "No, I wasn't".
We think since it's been 10 years, he should let it go and move on. The affair itself was over 2 years long.
Can't anybody understand that covering up our mistakes only makes them worse? 10 years of "good" behavior hasn't put the issue out of mind for labyrinth. I do not press the matter to heap guilt on him, but rather to help straighten some moral compasses. There IS a clear answer on this issue, but most do not accept it because labyrinth has "suffered enough". Suffered, yes, out of his own choice. If someone else wounds us, we are justified in suffering. If we wound ourselves intentionally, we're not the brightest crayon in box. So why is keeping this secret such a smart thing?
realmenluvporn has strong, honest opinions, but it is his loss that he has blocked Christianity out of his life forever. It is truly to his loss. Many of us have tried to reach him, but his hatred is a mask for pain he has suffered. He won't admit that to anyone else, much less to himself, and now he's at a point where he'd let his own kids do porn if they wanted to, hypothetically - and that is heartbreaking.
We're not good enough to avoid every mistake, and we're not good enough to immediately admit those mistakes...but that's what the forgiveness of Jesus is for - we admit our guilt and ask forgiveness, and He grants it. But if Jesus is nothing but a fairy tale to some, then that forgiveness is an option they rejected. And if someone does not admit guilt to those they sinned against, how do they expect to be forgiven for continuing deception and lying? That's why Jesus' grace to us is so important - when we stray or fall mightily, He is always there. We don't have to be good enough to avoid mistakes - just know enough to admit them and desire to change.
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hotaka said on Sep 06, 2006....
Yeah, your point about covering up mistakes is good. That's why it reminded me of the song lyric "how many words we waste to justify a crime." In labyrinth's case he uses no words to cover it up. Obviously he is really struggling with this issue. There was a movie I saw once where the husband had an affair and the wife found out. She was heartbroken but decided that she really loved him and would give him another chance. She told him he had to work really hard to earn her trust again but she would give him the chance. A Japanese drama I watched years ago dealt with a similar topic. In both cases the husband was given a chance to earn his wife's trust back. Labyrinth doesn't need that guilt eating at him. I only hope things work out for the best.
I followed rmlp for a while. He seemed clever but a bit too strong in his anti-Christian beliefs. Maybe he's a great guy in other ways. It's too bad that he considered you and RollingC such a threat to his way of thinking.
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mymave2006 said on Sep 27, 2006....
Madstorm,
Gods love is unconditional....... He created you not as a Robot to believe in Him, He created you by giving you the freedom of Choice to love and believe in Him or not.
It is your choice! But God gave us His word in the Bible.... those who adhere and believe on it will have that Great Great Prize ant that is everlasting Life (John 3:16)
Lidstorm,
continue writing!!!! enlighthen the world!
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mymave2006 said on Sep 27, 2006....
sorry ,its Lidstrom not lidstorm.....
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madstorm said on Sep 27, 2006....
Errrm... "freedom of Choice to love and believe in Him or not" ... and if I don't believe I am condemed to Eternal damnation... hmmm... sounds like a condition to me...
"God gave us His word in the Bible" ... how do you know that exactly? can you read Ancient Hebrew and successfully translate it for your own understanding? Well, I'm impressed... I speak English, German and Spanish and I can tell you... the meaning of words and phrases DO NOT translate well into other languages...
Start thinking!!!! Enlighten yourselves!
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lidstrom82 said on Jul 19, 2007....
Madstorm - would it be better, in your eyes, for everyone to be loved whether they knew God or not? Because that's what God does.
Or, would it be better to do whatever we want regardless of God's love for us? The flaw in that is that if we have free reign to do whatever we want, without a limit or condition, it's mighty tempting to be selfish. And that is NOT love.
In other words, we need rules to follow and an example to go by. The life of Jesus Christ is the perfect example. Loving someone also includes correcting and punishing. Some kids today own the household because their parents think punishing them is too cruel. No, raising a lawless child who never experienced correction is cruel to the child, because if they think they can do whatever they want, they could spend time in jail, live a rebellious life, or die of a drug overdose. Without limits, we can make stupid decisions.
So yes, God does love us unconditionally. That specifically means that we can't do anything to make Him love us less, or more. It is a constant, unchanging thing that allows the worst of sinners to find forgiveness from God. Once you repent, the slate's wiped clean. In effect, it's best to LOVE without limits. But in matters of morality, we need instruction and something to hold us accountable so that we don't hurt others with our selfishness.
But if you abuse God's love, or refuse to acknowledge it, then it's rebelling against God, whether you know it or believe it. God can love us unconditionally AND punish us if we disobey. Being grounded by a week by your parents makes you think they hate you at the time, but you ended up learning discipline (hopefully). God tests us and corrects us in many ways, whether we spend our Sundays in church or recovering from a hangover (or both!). Unfortunately, the rules are clear in the Bible. Scoffing at them doesn't take anyone off the hook. Reading the Bible with an open mind and seeking God will pretty much reveal that disregarding it is foolish.
And if God is God, His Word will accomplish its purpose, regardless of the language.
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one_wired_kitty said on Sep 13, 2008....
Don't let it get you down, dear. Just keep telling the truth. Some just can't handle being convicted.
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