silverwhisper's tags:
well, it’s certainly been a while since i wrote one of these—indeed, it was approximately a month ago i posted the last one. i find myself on a train into the city, as i did so many times in the past, and that, combined with something i saw yesterday on SC, was the impetus for this blog entry.

(apologies beforehand, but this is pretty long—in fact, it’s almost double the length of one of my usual installments. turns out i had a lot to say here, i’m afraid.)

i was commenting to a blog entry by beyond that got me thinking about pop culture references.

there’ve been a few blog entries in the past few months that i’ve seen that discussed quotations from TV shows or movies, such as beyond’s, and they all touch on something that i’ve been meaning to address—for a while.

the most casual reading of a lot of classical literature shows that the writers were fond of using imagery and language from previous works, works with which they knew their audiences would be familiar: the literature that they considered “the classics”. one such touchstone is of course the bible: so many of our figures of speech, idioms and the like are drawn from that fertile, fertile ground. if i say to you that a man was a veritable samson, you would recognize the reference to the biblical figure—and perhaps wonder if like samson, that man has his own delilah, waiting to cut his hair and rob him of his strength. or if i say that another man faced a terrible trial but faced it with the patience of job, you recognize that pillar of patience, and perhaps wonder if his trial too will have its reward. or if i remark that a woman has the sagacity of solomon, you are familiar with the tale of his pronouncement that a child should be cut in half, knowing that the true mother would object and prefer the child be given to the other woman rather than be killed.

the bible is the touchstone of western literature. in a very real way, it all begins with the bible.

but at the same time, those aren’t the only sources from the writers of days past draw: shakespeare and others were never afraid to refer to classic mythology. even in the tragedy romeo and juliet, a simple description refers to phoebus, the roman name by which the greek deity apollo was known. it’s a relatively minor description (i don’t recall the act/scene citation off-hand; i believe it’s during juliet’s balcony scene), which itself highlights to me the degree to which shakespeare expected his audience to recognize such references.

IOW: these things were the common lexicon, if you will, of the audience of the day. everyone understood it, everyone knew the references. they were part of the language of everyday life—the language of the common man.

but they no longer really are—at least, not to the extent they once were. not nowadays, anyway.

you might well be wondering what all of this has to do with pop culture—i’m getting to that.

i’m reminded of a conversation i had w/ my siblings when we were all younger. my sister was in high school, while my brother and i were younger. he and i were—as we often did—having a conversation largely consisting of quotations from films and TV shows. she observed that this was to her sad, that it was impossible to have a conversation with us w/out being conversant with those references.

now, we can talk about the merits of whether a person should or should not be steeped in pop culture ‘til the cows come home, but that’s a separate and for my purposes entirely unrelated issue.

there’s a kind of snobbery in the halls of literary criticism—or at least was when i was still studying it back in college—that favors references of an older vintage. i suppose in their view, the passage of time vets a given source as being worthy of reference or not.

i think that’s tragic.

sure, i can reel off the shakespearean citations if i really need to—but to whom would i make them but other lit buffs and the odd shakespeare freak? no one. at the end of the day, the object of any writer or creator of creative work is to attempt to communicate with the person reading or otherwise experiencing his or her work. if it’s a complete garble, then the writer/artist failed.

but you see, there’s a handy common lexicon already here.

and we call it pop culture.

now, i’ve certainly got my issues with pop culture, but the one thing you cannot say about it is that it’s anything but democratic. things that people like join that shared vocabulary no matter who pooh-poohs it, or indeed, precisely because someone pooh-poohs it. ideas, concepts and things that gain that kind of mindshare are relevant, b/c people see it as engaging in some fashion.

if shakespeare were alive today, he’d probably reference things like star wars. because as the writer he was, he would understand that in order to communicate with people, he must speak their language—which brings me to the subject of william wordsworth.

in 1780, wordsworth and his friend, samuel taylor coleridge, published a collection of their poetry, lyrical ballads. if you don’t count the earlier work by william blake (although most literary critics do), the publication of lyrical ballads kicked off the romantic movement in literature. in the preface thereto, wordsworth famously made an observation which i find highly relevant:

wordsworth quoth:
i write in the language of the common man.

now, on the face of it, this makes sense: there’s no sense writing poetry if it remains opaque and impenetrable to a reader. granted, in his day, that still meant the use of rhyme and meter, which have fallen out of favor these days, but that’s neither here nor there: there’s a second, more important ramification to this statement, i think.

that ramification is simple: the poet is saying that when he writes poetry, he writes in everyday language. in part this is a reaction to the poetry that was common at the time—positively rife with obscure references. but taken with my very favorite wordsworth quotation of all time, it means something more:

wordsworth also quoth:
poetry is the spontaneous overflow of emotion, recollected in tranquility.

taken together, twhat the poet is saying here then is that this overflow of emotion, when recollected in tranquility, expresses itself in the idiom of the day.

i don’t know about you, but i find this fantastically encouraging news. because what it really means, at least IMHO, is that poetry (and by extension, all writing) should be accessible and represent the way the writer him or herself would express an idea, without excessive ornamentation.

so when we use pop culture quotations—such as discussed in the blog entry that sparked this one—are we really doing anything differently than wordsworth or shakespeare themselves did?

i say no.

these things form our collective frame of reference, our shared vocabulary…our common lexicon, as i called it earlier. we express ideas and thoughts in the words that are available to us.

now, here’s the funny thing: wordsworth’s poetry was, as i said earlier, a reaction to the poetry that was prevalent in his day. but were i to write something that depended meaningfully upon references to his poetry, how many people would pick up on those references? hell, i don’t think that i would myself, and i don’t know how many people could say that they would. if you would, then i commend you for being better versed (if you’ll forgive the pun) in wordsworth’s poetry than i am.

but if, like me, you wouldn’t, then i say this. there’s a saying: “it’s a poor craftsman who blames his tools.” the meaning of that is pretty clear: if the craftsman’s work is not good, then the blame lies with the craftsman. in the same way, a writer (and again, i mean this to apply to all creative endeavors, not merely writing) must take care in composing a work to ensure that it really does communicate to a reader/viewer the writer’s intent.

and yes, that means, of necessity, using the common lexicon. and yes, that means pop culture.



so what’s your view of pop culture? is it a modern-day analogue to mythology and classic literature in that way? or do i really need to get some caffeine and reverse my cranial-rectal inversion? or perhaps i’m near the point but not inside the bullseye? comment and let me know. :>

ed

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Comments

  • Actorguy said on Mar 11, 2008....
    The odd Shakespeare freak? Hey that's me.....although I prefer the term Shakespeare Geek :-D.
     
    Here's that quote you referred to:
     
    Gallop apace, you fiery-footed steeds,
    Towards Phoebus' lodging: such a wagoner
    As Phaethon would whip you to the west,
    And bring in cloudy night immediately.
    Spread thy close curtain, love-performing night,
    That runaway's eyes may wink and Romeo
    Leap to these arms, untalk'd of and unseen.
     

    Phoebus here refers to the sun, and the "fiery-footed steeds" are the clouds (imagine the sun lighting up the bottom of the clouds). Juliet is praying that the day pass quickly because Romeo is coming tonight. Its not really on point but I'm getting there.

    Shakespeare is full of classical references and archaic words, and that is a real problem in performance.  Modern day audiences have no idea who Phaeton is or that Phoebus is another name for the sun. Somehow you have to convey the meaning of words and references that the audience doesn't understand..... either that or cut them.

    It seems to me that references to pop culture automatically date the piece.  Pop culture from my youth would have been about Archie Bunker or "The Man from UNCLE".  If I'd written poetry or prose about them, who today would even understand it?


  • silverwhisper said on Mar 11, 2008....
    hey actorguy, long time no see! :>

    i agree re: shakespeare--it's the language that's inaccessible, not the subject matter, which continues to speak to us through the centuries. i think that kenneth branagh's films do a marvelous job of making the language feel lighter to our contemporary ears, myself.

    i agree that pop culture references can date a piece--but if you refer to an 18 1/2 minute gap, you're going to recognize that reference, no? if you quote from casablanca, that's still instantly recognizable, wouldn't you say?

    ed
  • Zayda said on Mar 11, 2008....
    It's not just that pop culture can date a piece, as Actorguy noted, but many pop culture reference are culturally contextual (as in national cultures). Thus, the problem with drawing on or alluding to many things in pop culture is that those references may not cross certain cultural/ethnic/geographic boundaries.

    Further, pop culture is "wider" today than it was in Shakespeare's time. Mythology was the popular culture of Shakespeare's time as was the Bible (I'm sure some will cringe at that notion.) But because there is such a depth of what can now be drawn on--Mythology, the bible, history, Shakespeare, current film, television, music, there is less likelihood that all readers will get the references.

    And to answer the question you posed to Actorguy, no, "18 1/2 minute gap" is not instantly recognizable. And neither would a quote from Casablanca be to many people today. Perhaps it would be to me and you, but I can guarantee you that no one in my classes except the student who is my age would recognize a quote from Casablanca.

    Two years ago, I had to explain who Bob Dylan was to two classes because not one student out of the 48 in those two classes knew who he was. I had to explain who Nirvana was to one class because no one in the class knew who they were; they vaguely knew that Kurt Cobain had committed suicide, but they didn't connect him to the band Nirvana or grunge in any way.
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 11, 2008....
    super z: you're absolutely right that pop culture references are culture-specific--i hadn't thought of that.

    [looks rueful]

    yes, pop culture does encompass a whole lot more now than it did then, i agree--and i do agree with your statements re: the bible and mythology. so yes, there's bound to be a certain..."balkanization", if you will, of what constitutes pop culture, in that i've been discussing it as a single monolithic thing when that's not the reality.

    perhaps it's in part age-related, which i think your point re: your students and kurt cobain (which i gotta say boggles my mind!) could suggest. that you had to explain about bob dylan for some reason isn't terribly surprising to me, but i'm still surprised re: cobain.

    i guess that fact dates me all by itself, doesn't it?

    ed
  • Zayda said on Mar 11, 2008....
    One of the first pieces of advice I was given in grad school about writing for international audiences was to keep allusions and references to popular culture at a minimum because those reference don't often cross international boundaries. References to widely popular media will sometimes work, but it has to be something that has been a cross-national phenomenon.


    I have more to say about this, but don't really have the time right now.
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 11, 2008....
    i'm looking forward to the time you do, super z. :>

    that's a good piece of advice you got.

    ed
  • the_infernal_optimist said on Mar 12, 2008....
    It all really does hinge on knowing your audience well - who might read what you want to say, and then what might best convey the meaning of your work to them? That occasionally irritates me with my writing, and you can really go round and round with yourself: Do I write this with a specific audience in mind, or do I write it however the hell I want, knowing that whichever way I write, a certain segment of the population will be attracted to it more than if I composed the piece any other way?

    Using pop culture references is very tricky - but sometimes you want to nail a piece down, give it an "in the moment" feel and let it age as it will. Think cheese, I guess. :-D You do always run the risk of alienating some members of your audience by leaving them wondering what the heck a certain reference means, but you're also likely to garner the enthusiasm/approval of the people who somehow feel connected to that reference.

    I suppose it depends on what your overall intent is, as to whether weaving pop culture into your writing is wise or not. It's fairly natural to do that, but it might not always be the best way to say something.

    ~Infernal
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 13, 2008....
    well said re: knowing your audience. it depends upon what you're writing--and why, IMHO.

    if i'm writing a contemporary novel, then i might want to reference the events and people of the day, to help cement the versimilitude. i think that in such a case, using such references is not only useful, but highly so.

    naturally, writing of a different sort might require something different from the writer.

    mm...cheese... :D

    ed
  • TinSoldier said on Mar 17, 2008....
    I can't believe I missed this one! Well written as usual, ed.

    I just want to echo what infernal said above about knowing one's audience. Isn't that one of the first lessons you learn in either a speech or a writing class? For me it was, at least at the college level.

    I just want to point out a f'rinstance -- Firefly references. You were discussing something in another blog and used the words "gorram" and "creepifying". For someone like me who is in the know, your idea comes across more clearly than if you had chosen almost any other group of words. It increases the signal-to-noise ratio.

    But for people who aren't in the know, it lowers the signal-to-noise ratio and they lose a portion of the message or the subtext.

    Oh, and Zayda's point was important too, but as infernal said it boils down to knowing your audience. And knowing your audience will inform you as to what cultural references are appropriate and which are not.

    Okay, now you got me thinking about the one Star Trek TNG episode that is all about that! Darmok and Jilad at Tanagra.

    Meta.
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 18, 2008....
    TS: well thank you! :>

    sorry it's taken me so long to get back to your comment. yes, i use firefly-isms (and indeed, whedon-isms) with great glee and abandon and i'm unapologetic about that. much of that is simple force of habit, for reasons w/ which i believe you're already familiar, but at the same time, i employ those expressions as well when addressing my comments to a specific person who groks 'em--i can say those things to you or super z or LG or kyle & nat, and i know you understand my meaning. as you say: higher S:N.

    knowing your audience, yes: it's a poor writer who doesn't write to the intended audience. this ranges from format and subject matter all the way down to lexicon, yes. but at the same time, aren't there certain references one can use (e.g., the omnipresent "doh!" or "no soup for you!") that practically everyone will recognize?

    ed
  • the_infernal_optimist said on Mar 18, 2008....
    Heh...Whedon-isms. :-D

    And fwiw, "No soup for you!" means absolutely nothing to me, other than the reference made to it in Kyle's soup entry. [shrug] I don't think I count for much there though, as I only erratically catch any tv I actually *want* to watch.

    ~Infernal
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 19, 2008....
    [ships infernal the firefly boxed set]
  • Actorguy said on Mar 19, 2008....
    And here I thought you made up "gorram" and "creepifying"!  I hang my head in shame that I don't know firefly, but the words were easy enough for me to grok.  BTW was "grok" used in Firefly also, because I know it from Heinlein's "Stranger in a Strange Land".
  • silverwhisper said on Mar 19, 2008....
    heh...i highly recommend firefly--some of the best writing on TV, if you ask me. :>

    i'd quite forgotten that grok is from heinlein--thanks for the reminder, actorguy. :>

    say, how's your niece?

    ed

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