• the_infernal_optimist said on Mar 06, 2008....

  What the hell??
  
  Note to self: Do not move to CA during the kids' school years. :-p Not that I think I'll homeschool, but I feel I ought to have that option. Homeschooled kids still have to pass tests and things that should let their school districts know how they're doing - it's not like you can just say, "Oh, we homeschool" and then just play all day.
  
  ~Infernal
  

• nytquill17 said on Mar 06, 2008....

  As someone who was homeschooled for 5 different school years, who was her own teacher for the last two years of high school (my parents were more than intelligent enough to teach me, but so was I ;) ) and who graduated with a diploma from a home school, this bugs me. I'm pro-homeschooling when the circumstances line up to point to it, but I'm not anti-public schools either.  I got a lot of good out of both and the same thing doesn't work for everybody.  I can understand why people would be worried about homeschoolers - it's certainly not for everybody - but in most states you are not "out of the system" at all.  For example for my high school years, I know we had to submit our cirriculum plans every semester and report my progess and I had to follow the state-mandated cirriculum to a degree.  I could choose a lot of my own material within the course but I still had to have something that would qualify as English, math, etc. at the proper grade level.  And there was always the chance of a random inspection, though we never got called on in the two years we ran the school.
  
  And I went on to earn straight As in every class but two in three years of state university ;)
  
  People are just afraid of whatever they can't understand and can't control.
  

• uniquely-ironic said on Mar 06, 2008....

  I have to play devil's advocate here. 
   
  My cousins were home schooled by their mother.  She was NOT the kind of person who could discipline the children and wasn't exactly a high wattage bulb herself.  As a result, those girls have the meagerest of educations and not a one of them has considered college.  It's entirely possible these girls will end up living off the state as a result of having no discernable skills.
   
  I'm all for home school if the parent has the ability to teach, but how is that monitored effectively?  I think to outlaw it is too extreme, but I'd be in favor of the teaching parent having to pass a basic test to prove they are capable of doing the material themselves.
   
  The testing and monitoring by the state is sadly unable to keep track of all homeschooled children at least in California.  I would have considered schooling mine, but only up to a grade level that I was absolutely confident I could teach them as well as a professional teacher.

• the_infernal_optimist said on Mar 06, 2008....

  Ah, but there are incompetent teachers with licenses from the state, and students who graduate from public schools (which, btw, I'm not against - I was in public schools and feel I fared pretty well) who are no better educated than the girls you speak of, u-i.
  
  [shrug] Accountability pretty much always has loopholes, I'm afraid. It doesn't matter which system you're looking at - public, private, homeschooling: you'll still find shocking incompetence if you look far enough, and plenty of success stories, too.
  
  I'm not saying there shouldn't be some sort of stricter requirements for parents who want to homeschool, but that requiring a demonstration of competency doesn't necessarily guarantee better results.
  
  ~Infernal
  

• GracefullyGrowing said on Mar 06, 2008....

  I have home educated for a very long time.  (My oldest is 27, my youngest 7)
   
  While I whole heartedly agree that home educating is not for everyone, and that there are some who are not equipped for the challenge it most certainly is, to state that it is not a constitutional right is utterly riduculous.  Such a sweeping statement is typical of education worshipers and closed thinking full of errors.
   
  There are other states that require a parent to have a degree (but it does not have to be a degree in education, it can be any degree) to home educate - llike Virginia.  There are states that require nothing of the sort - like Indiana.  There are many states who have laws between these two extremes.  Currently California does not have any specific laws concerning home education.  They are not even willing to try putting the effort in to accomodating parental authority and decisions by creating a system that works for them?  Just play big brother and make it form-fit to what is already in place by putting homeschooled children in the public system?  It would be fairly easy to adjust the systems of other states to find one that works for their own citizens.
   
  I won't even *start in* (fully) on the performance results of home educated students VS corporate schooled students.  I will only point out that home educated students consistantly do as well, or better, than corporate schooled students on standardized tests and higher education facility acceptance - and subsequently, graduation.  Home education is proven to NOT be a problem in our society as a whole, but a benefit.
   
  Funny, all these years I thought California was all about being tolerant, and live and let live.  The freedom of lifestyle that a person chooses has always been their banner.  But this sure doesn't look like that to me.
   
  Frankly, this scares me.  A lot. 
   
  Let freedom ring.
   
  ~Grace~ 

• D6fer said on Mar 06, 2008....

  I heard that this was coming some time ago......Teachers Unions are applying pressure to get rid of home schooling......they will attack private schools next.

• ALIENated said on Mar 06, 2008....

  
  http://baltimore.indymedia.org/usermedia/image/5/orwell_big_brother_watching.bmp
  
  
  

• Fallyn said on Mar 07, 2008....

  i'm in such a struggle right now.
  
  i was homeschooled part of my school years.
  it was a disaster.
  
  but my daughters........my middle is in kindergarten...and because of the damn NCLBA they had to cut recess out of her kindergarten!
  she doesn't get to set foot on the playground equipment even ONCE during the school day.
  
  i'm sorry, but it SERIOUSLY pisses me off.
  figuring that just because she's only there for a half day.......
  
  i mean....when she first went into school...she asked me....am i gonna get to play on there!? pointing at the playground....and i said. "of course honey!"
  
  *sigh* who in the world would think that you couldn't assure a six year old that YES you CAN play on the playground at school.
  
  and nearly every day she comes home and she cries.
  and i don't always have the ability during the day to take her to the playground.
  
  and it REALLY makes me mad.
  
  i'm just at such a loss. .....homeschool....won't work....i think for some parents it does.....but i know i do NOT have what it takes.
  public school....so many things wrong there.
  
  where can you turn?
  
  
  

• silverwhisper said on Mar 07, 2008....

  infernal: precisely--homeschooling is supposed to meet certain standards to ensure compatibility of education. what's funny is i know a few homeschoolers and i'm confident their kids are getting a vastly superior education, to be honest.
  
  nyt: i agree that there's a lot of fear, uncertainty and doubt (FUD) re: homeschooling. i didn't know that you were homeschooled yourself, though--i'd love to see a blog entry about that! i'm aware the standards vary from state to state, but in general my understanding is consistent w/ what you described.
  
  u-i: being able to recognize one's own limitations is of course hugely important, i agree. and i don't think anybody's arguing that there should be no standards for homeschooling. like infernal, i think that a parental demonstration of competence does not necessarily mean the kids are being educated well.
  
  grace: [applauds] brava!
  
  d6: the way the article reads, it doesn't sound to me like the teacher's union has anything to do with this, man. and i really don't see why they'd bother attacking private schools. ?!
  
  alienated: i can't believe i'm about to say this, but i agree.
  
  fallyn: good to see you again. :> wait--they cut recess because of NCLB?! i'm seriously not understanding how that happens: ?! is the school district cutting recess b/c their performance hasn't been sufficient or something? i know that NCLB yanks funding for poor performance, and that's the only way i can imagine it being related here.
  
  ed

• GrapeKoolaid said on Mar 07, 2008....

  All the kids that I've ever met that were home schooled were generally bright, but socially awkward in some way.   I can see how being home schooled by knuckle-draggin, window-lickin', mouth-breathers could have negative effects for the child, but to say that parents don't have the constitutional right to home school their kids?  That's two clicks away from saying that parents don't have the constitutional right to raise their own children.  

• GracefullyGrowing said on Mar 07, 2008....

  Not to be adversarial, especially toward you Grape, but every kid I know or have known is socially awkward in some way - regardless of how they are educated. =)
   
  If I may be further blunt, without being rude (I hope) or speaking personally toward anyone  -   I think people specifically LOOK for home educated kids to be socially awkward.  (Grape, I'm not saying you do/did/would do this! =)  People hear about how socially "bad" it is.  And I will certainly grant, before homeschooling became popular again, there weren't many opportunities for socialization beyond one's own family.  However, that's not been a problem for many years.  There are homeschool groups in almost every city/town available.  My kids had/have opportunity to be on sports teams, have proms and dances, graduations, various classes and extensive field trips and camps, and weekly get-togethers (as teens it was meeting at one another's houses for parties or going somewhere as a group; as younger it was called group "play dates".) that they most certainly enjoy, which we took/take advantage of.  Most homeschooling families are part of these organizations nowdays.
   
  I would add, many times one of the main reasons people home educate is because of the society within the schools.  They don't want their children exposed to that society at young ages.
   
  I hope this will be viewed as commentary, and education, and not me being a poot. =)
   
  ~Grace~
  (who's hoping y'all know what a poot is. LOL)

• GrapeKoolaid said on Mar 07, 2008....

  Grace:  Please accept my apology.  I was merely being facetious with that glib comment about home schooled kids being socially awkward.  You're right, of course.  All kids are socially awkward in one way or another.  As a matter of fact, my high school(public) had that Lord of the Flies aspect to it, where the authorities just let the children run wild.  That's not very healthy, either. 
  
  If I had kids, I would most definitely home school them.  They would be the test subjects of my most horrible social experiments.  God forgive me.  :D
  

• silverwhisper said on Mar 07, 2008....

  [walks up behind grape & trout-smacks him]
  
  :>
  
  ed

• kelly said on Mar 07, 2008....

  "I have home educated for a very long time.  (My oldest is 27, my youngest 7)"
  
  
  So, is your oldest getting close to graduation?

• kelly said on Mar 07, 2008....

  But seriously,  I suppose as long as home-school programs are held to the same "no child left behind" standards it should be allowed.  I still think, however, that the real reason behind most home schooling is that parents don't want their kids exposed to other ideas.

• Fallyn said on Mar 07, 2008....

  silver.....they cut recess because of nclb ....to give more in class time......to get the kids up to "standard", because recess is cutting into class time.
  which makes no sense....because the kids have an even more difficult time learning when they have no time to let off steam and go run around.
  the entire thing is ridiculous. and i know personally of three teachers who are quitting the whole teaching thing because of this damn nclb. .....
  
  i've talked to people the generation before me....like my mom...in elementary school they had two 25 minute recesses, and an hour lunch...and if you finished your lunch you got to go play until the bell rang....leaving your average eater.... (10-15 minutes to finish)......another 45-50 minutes to play.
  
  when i was in elementary school......we had two  20 min recesses, and half an hour for lunch.
  
  my oldest daughter....in 3rd grade.....gets two ten minute recesses, one of which is structured play only....games, etc. .....and 20 min for lunch.
  

• silverwhisper said on Mar 07, 2008....

  kelly: depending upon how you define "other ideas" that may or may not be a fair analysis. ?
  
  fallyn: man, i really don't get that. i remember naptimes, lunch...what the heck is going on there?!
  
  ed

• GracefullyGrowing said on Mar 07, 2008....

  Kelly - LOL.  Yeah, about 10 years ago!  =)
   
  ~Grace~

• Fallyn said on Mar 07, 2008....

  ed...i know...i remember laying down on mats in first grade.......they don't even do that in kindergarten anymore....and they wonder why kids just can't hold still and why more and more kids are having learning problems.

• GracefullyGrowing said on Mar 07, 2008....

  Grape - There is no need to apologize.  Nothing you said was offensive. Even the social experiments stuff.  ;~P
   
  ~Grace~

• silverwhisper said on Mar 08, 2008....

  fallyn: well, certainly part of it is NCLB--it's nonsense! they mandate teachers do so much in their classrooms, it's a wonder they haven't lengthened the schoolday! which incidentally would be a lot smarter than skipping naptimes and recess!
  
  ed

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