• quietone said on Feb 26, 2008....

  {{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}} I am so sorry for your pain and heartache paper. 

• the_infernal_optimist said on Feb 26, 2008....

  ((massive hugs))
  
  Oh, Paper...I'm so sorry you're hurting like this. I don't know what to say, except that I'm here and you're stronger than you think (and not alone!).
  
  ~Infernal
  

• mobil said on Feb 26, 2008....

  I had no idea of this Paper, maybe he will change as this develops and make the divorce the best in can be under the circumstances. All my best in this Paper, and God bless you and your little ones.

• queenparanoia said on Feb 26, 2008....

  {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{HUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
   
  that's all i could offer right now ate...

• secretlife said on Feb 26, 2008....

  How can you convince someone that you are unhappy with them you could die, without hurting their feelings?
  
  I don't think you can.
   
  you see, he loves you.  so if you tell him that you don't love him anymore, that's got to hurt his feelings.  that's got to hurt an awful lot jo, and especially now with the new baby there-
   
  i'm sure he's scared......so scared.
   
  and when you're afraid i think the natural instinct is to hold tighter.
   
   
  i understand what you mean when you say toxic to describe the relationship.
  i do.
  and how it feels like to stay, you sacrifice yourself....
   
  i understand what it is to feel yourself 'dying' to stay in that relationship....that the sacrifice is too great-
   
  the storybook divorces can only happen with two people who feel that ending the relationship is in BOTH of their best interests.  Or with one person who is almost a saint- willing to sacrifice his own feelings for the other.  You don't see that very often.  And maybe it's not realistic.  You have to make that determination because you know him best.  but it sounds like in your situation, you feel one way, and he another.
   
  i don't know a way 'out' without hurting him...and in doing so, going thru all that hard emotional stuff that can happen when a marriage ends.
   
  have you thought about seeing a counselor to help you both?
  perhaps that person, once they understand how you feel, can help him to understand? 
   
   
   

• pickersplock said on Feb 26, 2008....

  I think what secret said about seeing a counselor is very wise.
  Even if he won't go, you should.  Perhaps you'd be able to find a way somehow, given a different perspective.
  I wish I had better words, but I do know the depression I felt after both of our children were born.  There were times when I wanted to punch Mr. Plock right in the face, and times I just wanted to start driving away and not stop.................
  Things are so much better now.
  If he gets on my nerves now, I just make him a big heavy dinner, some cake, and slip some valerian root in with his vitamins!  He gets relaxed and very tolerable after that!  See, I've learned how to vent here.
  I hope things get better for you!
  Sending you the Monday tiara! ~^~
   

• dailyachesandpains said on Feb 26, 2008....

  Awe...I'm so very sorry this is still a tough spot for you.  {{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}
  I too completely agree with secret on this.  She couldn't have said it any better than she did. 
   
  Pickers:  What is valerian root and how can I get some?
   
  {{{{HUGS}}}}
  Daily

• pickersplock said on Feb 26, 2008....

  Valerian root is an herbal supplement, it produces a sense of calm relaxation, and is also a sleep aid.
   
  My chiropracter highly recommends it!

• SikariChepiNashota said on Feb 26, 2008....

  hey...so sorry to hear that paper...
  masakit ang mga bagay na to....pero dapat natin pag-ispan ng mabuti.
  hindi lamang buhay natin ang maapektohan..pati na rin ang mga mahal natin..lalo na ang mga bata.....its a sacrifice.....at depende to sa tao kung gaano natin kamahal ang ating pamilya.....sabi nga ng mga matatanda...ang pag aasawa ay hindi kanin na kung mainit ay puwede nating iluwa....
  what ever it is that is going on...i wish it'll all be clearer for you....
  kaawaan ka ng dios...
  

• GrapeKoolaid said on Feb 26, 2008....

  I wish you strength in this most difficult times, dear paper...  Words offer little comfort, I know.  It's hard being the bad guy...  I know that, too.  It's a careful balancing act between your life, your sanity versus some else's happiness.  One day it'll tip in favor of one or another.  What ever you choose to do, know that we're here for you.  Have courage.  It's never as bad as you think it is, though it may only look like that in hindsight, I don't know...  

• Lucytorial said on Feb 26, 2008....

  I'm so late I'm going to walk around with a sign on my head saying "Sorry I'm Late"
  
  Paper, judge you? for what? good lord, most people here (haven't read any comments yet) have probably experienced a heck of a lot of what divorce is like, least I can say is one thing.
  
  Be aware of yourself, allow yourself to grow, wanting to have things easy is not a fault or a fantasy it takes hard work to make that happen.. I don't see you giving up baby doll.  I wish I knew what to say, I wish I had experience in this, so far just the bickering bit, the close to divorce bit but not there... stay strong in yourself xo for real all my love girl.
  

• polarheart said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Paper, firstly a ((((big hug)))) to you.  May I ask some questions just to get a better understanding?  When did you first feel the need to end this marriage?  What is it that made you feel this way?  These are things I would want to know before I say my piece.  What is your motivation?

• merlin said on Feb 27, 2008....

  I wish you the greatest strength to deal with the trials that lay ahead

• Feline'sSoul said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Sweety... please dont get stuck in the current problems.
  I know its hard and seems unsolvable but you have to look ahead.
   
  Think about your next steps and do everything to manage it.
   
  So - what could be your next step?
   
  - make a list what you really want and what you dont want - and be honest to yourself (concerning relationship, where to live, how to live, moving, staying, searching a flat and so on)
  - make a list how much money you have a month (just to get an overview)
  - search for help (e.g. how to get more money - and get citizenship! that makes everything easer as you get help from state)
  - accept help from these social organisations who help young single mums
  - let friends help you and dont be just on your own with your problems!
  - go to that therapist a friend recommended you
  - dont let the depression slow you down
   
  you can make it sweety, i know it. you are one of the strongest and toughest women i know!
  you are just a bit frightened and scared atm and everything seems to be so difficult - use your elbows to get over that =)
   
  And get your husband out of that flat asap (if you wanna stay there in any case).
  I guess you cant have that easy and respectful divorce, as my previous speakers said, thats really rare. See, my parents dont had one either - it was a bit like the war of roses.
   
  But if thats the way it is - well, than you have to go that way.
   
  Dont care about him. Time for consideration is truly over.
   
  {{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}
   
  <333
   
  love ya

• kruuyai said on Feb 27, 2008....

  PAPER:  I felt exactly the same way about my marriage.  In fact, I got married because I didn't want to hurt his feelings.  He wasn't a bad guy.  I even cared about him... a lot.  But I wasn't in love with him, and we didn't want the same things out of life.  I felt that my  marriage to him was  a huge sacrifice... not just of opportunities to meet other men... opportunities to follow my dreams, make my own career choices, etc.  I stayed in the marriage longer than I wanted to (although it wasn't very long), because he seemed so dependent on me, so needy.  I was afraid of what he would do... not to me, but to himself, if I left. 
  
  And then there came a time when I just wasn't willing to make that sacrifice anymore.  And I left.  And he did try to commit suicide.  But he stopped himself before he succeeded, because he started thinking about how painful it would be when I found out, and it hurt too much.  His love for me kept him alive, even though I was no longer going to be in his life. 
  
  He tried to hang on until the bitter end.  He said he'd never be able to love anyone again.  He asked what he could do to make me happy, and I told him,
  
  "Let me go."  And he did.  And that was the greatest act of love that I had ever experienced.  We went our separate ways.  After some time for him to process the pain, we resumed limited contact as friends.  Two years later, he remarried.  He's still married to that woman, and they have two lovely teenage daughters.  He's got the life he always wanted, a life that would have been suffocating to me. 
  
  So, although your husband may think that he wants to keep this marriage together, it may be that he will eventually be happier outside of it, too.  Especially if you're so unhappy in it.  It really isn't possible for one person to be truly happy in a marriage if the other one is miserable.  Think about that.
  
  I know your situation is more complicated, because of your kids.  You have a lot to think about, but your children will be happier if you are happy. 
  

• Mamie said on Feb 27, 2008....

  ugh! I am so sorry for your pain in this story...and I reallllly wish I was close by to come give you a hug in person. I understand that you feel like you cannot breathe....I pray that you will find the words and the courage to make your move, whatever the right thing is...to save your own life and to make a better future for you, your kids, AND your husband. blessed be....mamie

• Me-Myself&I said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Paper, your friend, feline's soul is right. you got to have a plan that looks at everything and a second plan if plan A doesn't work out. i wish you all the best. this is the time you worry over you!! i'll be watching, reading, hoping, praying, wishing you all the peace in the world. (hug) i'm sorry that life is ....toxic. Be happy!! take care, i'll be seeing you and will be visiting you on another site today!! *smile* hey, hang-in there. nothing good comes easy. stay focus on what YOU want. ~see ya

• CreativeWoman said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Paper,
  All I can do is give you big (((((((hugs))))))) because I know exactly how you feel minus the children.  I just want to offer you my support in what little way I can since I obviously don't have the answers either.  I truly  wish you the best.
  
  CW
  

• PAPERBACKWRITER said on Feb 27, 2008....

  
  Thank you dear friends, for your understanding, sympathy,  warm words and support. 
  
  Writing made me breathe. 
  
  Writing my feelings, simply writing without thinking - reading your responses made me feel alive again. . .I have been feeling numb, nay , dead for the last weeks. . .and was getting worse and worse. . .
  
  It was liberating to let this out. . .and all your words are keys freeing the countless locks that is imprisoning my mind. . . my thoughts locked inside, were literally driving me mad.
  
  I hope you´ll forgive me if I don´t respond to each and everyone individually right away. 
  
  I will; I just need time.
  
  Most of you are aware of my struggles with manic-depression, and one of the coping mechanism of a bipolar is stepping back, which can  develope chronically that it leads to isolation. . .
  
  I am desperately fighting against it. . .
  
  . . .the lessons I learned to prevent that or overcome it are reducing stress and being honest. . .
  
  I am reducing my stress my being honest to all of you that I need time to answer you all...
  
  I have no problem facing problems head on. . .I only need a lot of time to do it. . .
  
  Again, thank you for understanding.  My words seems distant but my heart  is warm, near and eternally  grateful to you all.
  
  paper ~
  
  ~ quietone
  ~ infernal
  ~ mobil
  ~ queenie
  ~ secret
  ~ pickers
  ~ daily
  ~ Sikari
  ~ Grape
  ~ Lucy
  ~ polar
  ~ merlin
  ~ Sammy
  ~ kruu
  ~ Mamie
  ~ MeMy
  ~ CW
  
  
  I will try to come back tonight or as soon as I can. . .again, I hope you all understand. . .
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  

• skald said on Feb 27, 2008....

  I am so sorry. ((((((((((((((((((((Hugs)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
  If your husband wants it rather cut in half then the only solution is to go, Is it not. that is what Salomon would say.
  

• destinydiva said on Feb 27, 2008....

  paper, aww I'm glad I helped you in someway :-)
  I sooo wish fairy tale divorces exsisted :-) (((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))) xx
  
  
  

• evil_twin said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Paper, I'm so sorry to read about your pain and how complicated everything is for you. I just want everything to work out just as much as you do. I'm sending you positive happiness vibes and I hope that you'll stay strong and that everything works out.....
  
  -evil_twin LA
  

• dyingman said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Seems a little odd.
  Checked your entries since April 2007 and there's very little about these negative feelings about the marriage. 
  Not that it's anyone's business, but now it's getting offered up in big old cathartic globs.
  
  There's a lot of cheering going on fro divorce...not just your page but others and I don't think it less judgmental to encourage divorce without background than it is to hope your husband can find compromises that make the marriage rewarding once again.
  
  Call me a killjoy, I'll hope he'll help you patch things up if you try.
  If there's a story that makes such hopes foolish, I apologize in advance.
  
  Part of my distaste for divorce in general is it's used as an escape.  The question that fails to get asked is what one escapes TO.  Some people complain that seat belts trap you and if you don't wear one you can be thrown free from the car... into WHAT?  Traffic?  Trees?  A guardrail?  I'll take my chances with the padded seat and paneling inside the car.
  
  It's not just a position of fear.  Coldly calculated, what else is out there?  Factor in severe economic hardship for the extra housing needed for a split family as well as economies of scale missed out on.  Chores shared that must be done alone...
  
  Divorce blows and the positive side of things is given a fair amount of air around here.
  When it happens to someone I know and I can't hide behind an alias, I can't ask them what's on my mind.  "Now what?  How is this sure to be better?"
  
  Judgmental?  Sure.  Guilty as charged, but it isn't for you, Ms. PBW.  It's against the knee-jerk reaction towards divorce.  Both ways.
  
  *DM
  
  
  
  
  
  

• Jenna said on Feb 27, 2008....

   

  Jo......I could have written your words several years ago.  I have been separated for four years with a divorce settlement right around the corner.  I am pleased to say that mine has been as "fairy tale"as I think it could be.  My ex and I have kept things respectful and have continued to be there for our children through all of their celebrations. 

  I too felt it was an issue of survival.  I had to get out.....  for reasons I do not wish to share here.  Yes there was hurt.  A lot of hurt and millions of tears.  And the kids...well they were hurt too.  But as I said, we have done the best we can to keep our family intact the best way we can.  I have said to my daughter many times....do you see that daddy and I can still do this together but apart. 

  I do not mean any disrespect to dying man......but I disagree with his assessment.... that divorce is a knee jerk reaction.  Unless you have lived through it.....one can truly not speak to the many emotions involved.  It is not an overnight decision. Yes, divorce sucks.  It is hard in so many ways......but there have been so many times when I find myself thinking that even on my worse day alone...it is better than living a life that was killing me inside.  What have I escaped to?   Life is the answer....I am living again.  That probably needs more explanation than I am willing to give now. 

  I agree with others here about the counseling.  I would have died without the aid of a wise woman who helped me through the tough times. 

  I wish you well as you continue your journey Jo. 

  Just one more thing I want to say  (well maybe two or three...lol) .......Stop being so hard on yourself.  No one expects you to respond to  every comment.  If I have said this once here at soulcast, I have said it 100 times.....we are all just doing the best that we can.  Somedays it is great...somedays it is all you can do to get out of bed and take care of the kids.  And as far as being judged.....I think in the past two years, I have finally given up on what others think about me.  We all have to answer to ourselves and our higher power if we believe.  Not one of us has the right to judge another......we all have our imperfections.

  With that said.....I offer you an ear, a shoulder at anytime you need. 

  God bless you my dear paper!

  xo......Jenna

   

• D6fer said on Feb 27, 2008....

  Paper....I hope you and your husband find the peace and love you both need....as well as the children.
  

• beautifulbecuaseofhim said on Apr 05, 2008....

  Wow.  I have read all the comments as well as your original post.  It is as if you have taken my very life and put it to paper.  I am dying a little more each day.  I struggle to survive but everyday that deny myself is another day I die a little more.  I don't want to hurt him, but after years of being hurt I cannot stay anymore.  He cries, he pleads, he promises not to hurt me anymore but he cannot change the very core of his being.  I stayed, because I could not bear to see his tears, could not bear the guilt he put on me, could not bear to ruin my children's lives.  I could not bear the fear of things he could do to hurt me or others.  And now, here I am, dying inside...numb to the life around me.  I struggle with depression.  How many times I have wished I could die, could sleep endlessly?  How man times have I dreamed of that peaceful darkness? 

  Yet everyday I get up  and I go on.  I see that one day something will give and I will find the strength in me to stand up to him.  I will find it in me to tell him he cannot control me anymore.

  One day...it will come.  And I will be free.  He will cry, he will plead, he will posture.  My children will cry and not understand why mommy is so mean.  But I will look them all down and say this is for the best.  In the beginning it will be hard, I will fight depression harder than I ever have.  I will fight against his guilt and his anger.  I will wonder if I have done wrong.  But, in time, this will get better.  Life will grow in me once again.  I will become the person God created me to be and I will be happy.  When I am happy, my children will be happy too and all will be well.

• dyingman said on Feb 16, 2009....

  For the record.  It sounds as though Jenna walked into her divorce with eyes wide open.

  The proof is her satisfaction with the unpleasant yet superior result.

  My concern is that not everyone thinks through teh consequences as carefulyl as she.  This fear may be overblown.  Perhaps most divorces are well thought out and I lack the information to realize this.

   

• PAPERBACKWRITER said on Feb 16, 2009....

  
  
  Thank you dyingman for revisiting this blog.
  
  I must admit a year ago, when I read your words I felt frustration, and yes, a bit of resentment.
  
  I have at times, re-read your words last year, as I  was in a destructive mood... and felt the guilt and responsibility of being the one to end the marriage.
  
  I understood your position because even before I got married, I vowed to try the best I can to make sure my marriage would work.  I grew up and watched unfaithful husbands, violent, irresponsible men and their faithful, loyal wives.
  
  I vowed to myself, the only reasons I would end a marriage is when my husband would be physically violent towards me or our children, or be unfaithful... All others things, I was convinced could be dealt with proper communication.  If need be with counselling.
  
  How can I write about the questions of sexuality of my husband (in answer to you query of a year ago....why I have not made a written account of my negative feelings towards the marriage).  He denies it himself now, and had even convinced me to the point that I too denied  what transpired one evening of his confessions.....and many other personal histories he related at the beginning of our marriage. What he has confided to me, and what he has related....were they lies?...there was a time I almost thought I was going insane...trying to understand...trying to salvage the institution of marriage.....trying to be loyal towards him.
  
  His anger directed at himself, later on indirectly towards me and to his children (not physical, but emotional, psychological) were major factors that started the emotional separation. 
  
  I have told him, I would remain as a friend, and be there for him when he goes through the transition he must be fearing.  I am not sure what to say to convince him, I don´t judge him, I would remain a friend but not on one hand as a wife, and on the other as a friend, listening to him and his stories - I don´t know how to define them...experiments...an exercise to feel he is alive...was it exhibitionism...homosexuality, bisexuality....I don´t know....I don´t know...
  
  I felt responsible to him, as one is for one´s marriage partner.  When I got sick and medicated just to survive my life with him, then it was my wake-up call.  I stayed, and this I am not ashamed of, for the longest time because I hoped, tried and was ready to compromise.  I had my beautiful children, roof over my head, and a home for them.
  
  My husband is an adult, who can take care of himself.  I am not responsible for whatever actions he might do to himself as he threatened me so many times to make me stay.  He has refrained from doing so, as we finally had a time of physical separation.
  
  Yes, perhaps you can count me under the "not knee-jerk reaction soon to be divorcee...." ...It took me almost  more than a decade to think this over.  But, I hope you will understand when I say, I don´t share you opinion that divorce is a knee-jerk reaction...my experience and observations has taught me otherwise.
  
  My apologies if this is longwinded.  I only had the urge to express myself, my thoughts.  It is after all my blog. LOL
  
  It is not a pleasant experience - divorce.  It is not a pleasant position to be the one to initiate it.
  
  I am not only recapturing my life but I am giving my husband a chance to live his life too, and our children the chance to lead a care-free life than they are living now.
  
  A belated thank you to:
  
  dearest skald
  dearest des
  dearest Kyle
  dearest Godmomsie
  dearest D6fer
  dearest beautiful
  
  ...my heartfelt thanks for your emotional support and friendship...
  
  and again dyingman..thanks for revisiting...... I needed to be reminded of how far I have come from this month a year ago...
  
  paper ~
  
  
  ...I have let out a silent scream...and hopefully a year to this day, i will let out a joyous sigh of relief and compose a poem of closure.....
  
  <3
  
  
  
  
  

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